Lemiuex decides to finally retire

[Taso]

I personally think Lemiuex was the greatest hockey player out there, and it sucks that all this shit happened to him in his life.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nhl/story/5274150
Pittsburgh Penguins center Mario Lemieux will announce his retirement Tuesday, according to a Pittsburgh Post-Gazette report.

The 40-year-old Lemieux has not played since Dec. 16 due to problems from an irregular heartbeat. He was diagnosed with atrial fibrillation last month but had been working out regularly and seemed intent on playing again this season.
As the Post-Gazette report points out, Lemieux retired retired for the first time in 1997, and was inducted into the National Hockey League Hall of Fame later that year.

He ranks as the No. 7 scorer in NHL history, with 690 goals and 1,033 assists in 915 career games.

Lemieux had seven goals and 15 assists in 26 games this season.

Lemieux assumed ownership of the Penguins in 1999 when it came out of bankruptcy. He came out of retirement in December 2000 and later that season helped lead the team to the Eastern Conference finals in his final playoff appearance.

[Hoagie]

He was the greatest player....ever. And it does suck that he was inflicted with so many ailments beyond his control over his career. But he still accomplished so much and his career should not be looked at as a disappointing series of injuries but a series of accomplishments unmatched by any other. He not only saved hockey in Pittsburgh but he has done it 3 times.

[EveryoneHasAIDS]

Hi, I'm Wayne Gretzky, ever hear of me?

I don't care if Lemieux dealt with ailments. He missed time and didn't quite put up the numbers of the Great One. Nobody was better at one point in time or spread out over an entire career.

[GoatAss]

Other than his heart condition, Lemieux wanted to play long enough this season to see his adopted son (not literally), Sydney Crosby off to a good start. Great f-in player though!

[Hoagie]

Hi, I'm Wayne Gretzky, ever hear of me?

I don't care if Lemieux dealt with ailments. He missed time and didn't quite put up the numbers of the Great One. Nobody was better at one point in time or spread out over an entire career.He didn't have one number. Points per game. Mario's was higher, which means if they played the same number of games, Mario would have more points. Mario also played in a much more competitive league. Gretzky got most of his points when there was no competition for for him to play against. He had all the best players on his team.

[EveryoneHasAIDS]

He didn't have one number. Points per game. Mario's was higher, which means IF they played the same number of games, Mario would have more points. Mario also played in a much more competitive league. Gretzky got most of his points when there was no competition for for him to play against. He had all the best players on his team.


If, my friend, if. If doesn't cut it. Gretzky owns every hockey record, nuff said, best ever.

[HockeyHelmet]

F' cup cake, you ask anyone who played with or against him, shit ask gretzky, he wasn't the most skilled or best player, he was constintly in the right spot at the right time. Skill wise it goes to lemiuex.

[EveryoneHasAIDS]

Nobody said anything about skill The question is who is the greatest hockey player ever? The answer in Gretzky.

I don't know about you, but I base things like this on stats, championships, sportsmanship and what he does for the team overall. Stats=Gretzky. Cups=Gretzky. Sportsmanship=tie. Overall team effect, I can't really give the edge either way, but even in the end of his career, Gretzky still ran his "office" like no one else. He made every player on the ice better just by being there.

[HockeyHelmet]

Nobody said anything about skill The question is who is the greatest hockey player ever? The answer in Gretzky.

I don't know about you, but I base things like this on stats, championships, sportsmanship and what he does for the team overall. Stats=Gretzky. Cups=Gretzky. Sportsmanship=tie. Overall team effect, I can't really give the edge either way, but even in the end of his career, Gretzky still ran his "office" like no one else. He made every player on the ice better just by being there.

Gretzky has the most stanly cups now does he? I remember Messier winning a cup without Greztky when he was gone. And led another team to another one. You can't base something like this on stats, not in the game of hockey. The game developes too much from year to year. Does he hold the records, yep, is he one of the greatest, absolutly, the best, no. You take him off the oilers he doesn't lead in any of the stats catagories. He was surounded by some damn good players in LA as well. Plus the way the game was played then it was much more wide open. His goal total fell fast in the 90s. He shore could pass the puck though.

[EveryoneHasAIDS]

We're comparing Gretzky to Lemieux silly goose, not Messier.

[EveryoneHasAIDS]

You take him off the oilers he doesn't lead in any of the stats catagories. He was surounded by some damn good players in LA as well.

This is where our opinions differ. I think Gretzky made the other players on the Oilers/LA/Rangers better. In no way am I saying his teamates were chumps, those Oiler teams were freaking All-Star teams. All I'm saying is that he was the captain amongst all of those great players.

Let's say you have a team with both Lemieux and Gretzky. Who gets to wear the C on his chest? You know it's Gretzky. He runs the show.

[HockeyHelmet]

Gretzky averaged by the end about 100 assists per season which tells you how many he had in the beggining of his career, someone was puting the puck in the net for him?

But still he made some sick passes.

Hey Messier was more of a complete player then the two of them. So I had to bring him in to it. I am not challenging his records, they where well deserved, They will be tough to break mostly for the way he could find people on the rink and move the puck.

I am saying in the individual skill catagory he was not the best, probably not even close to the best, skill wise. Game wise and moving the puck on the rink, no one can touch him. Lemiuex follows him in that one. That doesn't make him the all around best player

[HockeyHelmet]

This is where our opinions differ. I think Gretzky made the other players on the Oilers/LA/Rangers better. .


Not the Oilers man. That ENTIRE team either went off and become apart of stanley cups else where or damn good teams.

[Taso]

Lemuiex was the type of player that not only himself did great but he also elevated the skill of everyone playing with him. He took could take a loser and mold them into a hockey god.

[Fred Told Me]

You make it seem like Lemieux never played with anybody. He had some damn good players in Pittsburgh throughout his career as well. Maybe not quite the talent Edmonton had, but a little guy named Jaromir Jagr contributed to Lemieux's greatness throughout the years.

[Taso]

You make it seem like Lemieux never played with anybody. He had some damn good players in Pittsburgh throughout his career as well. Maybe not quite the talent Edmonton had, but a little guy named Jaromir Jagr contributed to Lemieux's greatness throughout the years.
Compare Jagrs numbers to when he played with Lemiuex and without him, you tell me what looks nicer.

[Taso]

He didn't have one number. Points per game. Mario's was higher, which means if they played the same number of games, Mario would have more points. Mario also played in a much more competitive league. Gretzky got most of his points when there was no competition for for him to play against. He had all the best players on his team.
I also forgot to add to your point Hoag, the refs babied the NHL's golden boy, it was impossible to skate by him without getting a pentalty called on you. Lemiuex on the other hand got abused left and right and the refs turned a blind eye to him.

[Hoagie]

I also forgot to add to your point Hoag, the refs babied the NHL's golden boy, it was impossible to skate by him without getting a pentalty called on you. Lemiuex on the other hand got abused left and right and the refs turned a blind eye to him.I just left it at that because it's a simple enough concept. I learned long ago that most people will blindly follow stats without ever taking surrounding factors into consideration. I think most people would really have a change of mind if they sat down and watched the game against a good Rangers team where he scored a goal every way possible. He dominated that game by himself.

[Sack of Chisels]

He was good, but let's not all jump on the "greatest ever" bandwagon all of a sudden. Maybe he should have retired a few years ago and his health wouldn't have been this bad. Messier was indeed a better all around player, and also a smarter player; he got out before the game started to kill him.

[Hoagie]

He was good, but let's not all jump on the "greatest ever" bandwagon all of a sudden. Maybe he should have retired a few years ago and his health wouldn't have been this bad. Messier was indeed a better all around player, and also a smarter player; he got out before the game started to kill him.Wow! Messier?!?! At least the Gretzky people had stats to fall back on. Wow!

[Papagolash]

Good riddence. I would love to see him get hit by a car tomorrow. Too bad the cry baby already spead his cry babyness to another player, Cindy "look at me dive" Crosby.

[Hoagie]

Good riddence. I would love to see him get hit by a car tomorrow. Too bad the cry baby already spead his cry babyness to another player, Cindy "look at me dive" Crosby.Spoken like a true bitter Rangers fan. "Boo hoo, I don't like anyone who didn't play for the Rangers and lead them to yet another disapponting season that ends with no playoffs." :icon_lol:

[Sack of Chisels]

Wow! Messier?!?! At least the Gretzky people had stats to fall back on. Wow!
Well, Gretzky is the undisputed best of all time.

But Messier and Lemieux are a lot more comparable. But stats? Messier is 2nd to Gretzky in a lot of stats, Lemieux is not.

[Papagolash]

Spoken like a true bitter Rangers fan. "Boo hoo, I don't like anyone who didn't play for the Rangers and lead them to yet another disapponting season that ends with no playoffs." :icon_lol:

Yea because that's happening this season? :icon_roll

[Hoagie]

Yea because that's happening this season? :icon_rollEvery team makes the playoffs at least once in a decade and a half in hockey. But there is still time for the Rangers to blow it. It's not like they've never done that before.

[KneeKnee]

Lemiuex. Greatest. Ever.

[Taso]

Good riddence. I would love to see him get hit by a car tomorrow. Too bad the cry baby already spead his cry babyness to another player, Cindy "look at me dive" Crosby.
Hmm i remember how at one point a season or two ago, the New York Rangers were a Penguins alumni team. It was as if Sather had taken his time to go buy up that old roster. Im sure you cheered for them while they were wearing your coveted red white and blue.

[Papagolash]

Hmm i remember how at one point a season or two ago, the New York Rangers were a Penguins alumni team. It was as if Sather had taken his time to go buy up that old roster. Im sure you cheered for them while they were wearing your coveted red white and blue.

No, the Rangers have been an Oilers alumni team for the last decade mostly. Luckily that's finally over and we're actually a team building from within.

The Penguins decided to go the Rangers route of the last 8 years this season, and stock up on overpriced, over the hill vets. Every Rangers fan called for the Pens to be awful this season because we've been dealing with the same shit the last 7 years.

[Taso]

The Penguins decided to go the Rangers route of the last 8 years this season, and stock up on overpriced, over the hill vets. Every Rangers fan called for the Pens to be awful this season because we've been dealing with the same shit the last 7 years.
No the Rangers are just bitter and angry because alot of you were expecting the league to tilt the draft lottery in your favor because it would be "good for hockey" to have Crosby come to New York.

[Papagolash]

It's "good for hockey" when the Rangers are winning period.

[HummerTuesdays]

It's "good for hockey" when the Rangers are winning period.

So you admit that it was a bad move that the Rag$ over priced the market (for non-winning talent, no less) under the previous CBA? :icon_mrgr

It's still early in the season. There's plenty of time for the Devs to make the playoffs, and plenty of time for the Rag$ to choke.

As for the greatest, that's all relative. Stats are great, but they only show one dimension of the player. You have to take into account teammates, the refs, health, rule changes, etc. From what I understand there was an unwritten "Don't touch Gretzky" rule. A lot of players would put up better numbers if they weren't behing checked and bumped, but then that's not hockey, is it?

[HockeyHelmet]

It's "good for hockey" when the Rangers are winning period.
Agreed

[HockeyHelmet]

So you admit that it was a bad move that the Rag$ over priced the market (for non-winning talent, no less) under the previous CBA? :icon_mrgr

It's still early in the season. There's plenty of time for the Devs to make the playoffs, and plenty of time for the Rag$ to choke.

As for the greatest, that's all relative. Stats are great, but they only show one dimension of the player. You have to take into account teammates, the refs, health, rule changes, etc. From what I understand there was an unwritten "Don't touch Gretzky" rule. A lot of players would put up better numbers if they weren't behing checked and bumped, but then that's not hockey, is it?

I don't think anyone put the body on cup cake, ever.

[Hoagie]

So you admit that it was a bad move that the Rag$ over priced the market (for non-winning talent, no less) under the previous CBA? :icon_mrgr Hold on. The Rangers don't get all the credit for that. The Flyers did their part too.

[HummerTuesdays]

Hold on. The Rangers don't get all the credit for that. The Flyers did their part too.

I'll give a lot of teams credit for that, except the Devils. They managed to win with one of the lowest salaries in the league year after year, while the Rangers continued to lose with the highest salary.

[Taso]

I don't think anyone put the body on cup cake, ever.
I dont know if your constant use of the word cupcake if your attempting to make a lame Lemuiex joke, but Lemuiex would get the same treatment any other hockey players whos name was not Gretzky would get. He would take his beatings just like the rest of them, until recently when he came out and called out alot of refs for missing calls.

[Taso]

It's "good for hockey" when the Rangers are winning period.
Unfortunately I have to agree with you on that point. One of the highest points hockey had was back in 94 when the Rangers won the cup. Unfortunately the rest of America follows New Yorks lead on these things.

[Papagolash]

So you admit that it was a bad move that the Rag$ over priced the market (for non-winning talent, no less) under the previous CBA? :icon_mrgr




Ummm fuck yea. Rangers, Toronto, Philly, Colorado and Detroit all pushed the spending up high. Only reason it looks rediculous with the Rangers was the fact that each team fucking sucked.

[HockeyHelmet]

I dont know if your constant use of the word cupcake if your attempting to make a lame Lemuiex joke, but Lemuiex would get the same treatment any other hockey players whos name was not Gretzky would get. He would take his beatings just like the rest of them, until recently when he came out and called out alot of refs for missing calls.

Cupcake='s Gretzky, you would be a fool and have no buisness posting in this thread if you thought lemiuex was soft.

Lemiuex took beatings, he was a big guy, he didn't back down either, like Messier.

Gretzky on the other hand, the rink for him was like one of the European leagues, no hitting Gretzky.

[Taso]

Cupcake='s Gretzky, you would be a fool and have no buisness posting in this thread if you thought lemiuex was soft.

Lemiuex took beatings, he was a big guy, he didn't back down either, like Messier.

Gretzky on the other hand, the rink for him was like one of the European leagues, no hitting Gretzky.
Oh ok, so we've been saying the same thing. I just got confused cuz that cupcake line to me came out of nowhere.

[HockeyHelmet]

yep

[Fr. Dougal]

Spoken like a true bitter Rangers fan. "Boo hoo, I don't like anyone who didn't play for the Rangers and lead them to yet another disapponting season that ends with no playoffs." :icon_lol:

I'm a Ranger fan, too... but seriously, Crosby IS a little bitch. Fuck him. Ovechkin and Phaneuf are much better.

[Fr. Dougal]

So you admit that it was a bad move that the Rag$ over priced the market (for non-winning talent, no less) under the previous CBA?


Um... haven't us Ranger fans been saying this for the past 7 years? NO ONE is harder on Rangers management than Ranger fans.

[HummerTuesdays]

Um... haven't us Ranger fans been saying this for the past 7 years? NO ONE is harder on Rangers management than Ranger fans.

Very true. I guess it was about 5 years ago I went to a Rag$ game. I couldn't believe 1) how empty the "sold out" game was and 2) how brutal their own fans were to the players & coach.

[Taso]

2) how brutal their own fans were to the players & coach.
I gotta say, I really miss the "Fire Sather" chants, that was one thing i really loved chanting when i would go to Ranger games.