No more 60GB PlayStation 3 in US after July

[Aero 1]

Bad move if this is true. It was a fire sale instead of a price cut.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=26704

SCEE president David Reeves has told GamesIndustry.biz that the 60GB PlayStation 3 will no longer be available in the US after stock sells out - which he predicts will occur by the end of the month.

Reeves was speaking at an E3 event to announce the introduction of a new PS3 bundle in Europe. When asked about possible criticisms over whether SCEE should have given consumers the option to pay a lower price, as SCEA has done, he replied, "Well, they're not really are they, because what the US are offering from the 1st of August is a USD 599 version with one game.

"All they're doing is taking their stock in trade that they've got at the moment of the 60GB model, marking the price down and it will all be gone by the end of July."

When asked to clarify if this will mean the end of the 60GB model, Reeves answered, "In America, yes."

SCEA announced a USD 100 price cut for PlayStation 3 earlier this week. A new 80GB model will come bundled with a copy of Motorstorm and will retail for USD 599.

[BelatedAbortion]

I have it on good authority from a Sony exec that they'll be dropping the price of the 80 gig by the end of the summer.

[Bill Lehecka]

At least with the 360, the price has stood firm for 2 years and are just thinking of a price drop. The PS3 dropping prices and discontinuing models reeks of desperation.

[Grem]

The 80 gb with motorstorm was limited edition, when the stock of 60gbs run out they will discontinue the limited edition 80gb with motorstorm and sell just the 80gb version on its own for $499.

[BlackNinja]

if thats the case, then why would anyone buy the 599 80gb packaged with motorstorm when the 80gb will be 499 on its own thereafter?

edit: kotaku says that the 60gb for 499 will be phased out, and then the 80gb for 599 will take over, which is unbelievably stupid if thats true http://kotaku.com/gaming/say-what%3F/60gb-ps3-being-taken-out-to-pasture-278039.php

[MrBogey]

The PS2 had a price drop 8 months after launch.

MS didn't drop the price of the 360 because people would pay it. Just like the rubes who are paying 7$ for 3 songs on GH2 for the 360.

Sony must be planning on selling a million PS3s if they think America will be out of 60GB models by the end of July.

[Deadbent]

The older ps3's are going to be superior though, for emulation reasons.

[CM Mark]

The way stock is moving around here, there will still be 60gb versions available next year

[Monstercloud]

Can we call it the P$3 now?

[MrBogey]

Can we call it the P$3 now?

Whatever. Quality pays, man. The 360 was priced like a VW bug but built like a Yugo. Where's the value in that? I'd rather spend 600$ on the PS3 and 150$ on a new video card so I can play the top 360 games on a superior platform with more content (the PC) that way there's almost nothing non-exclusive and no worrying about having my system crap out on me.

[Magaman]

SONY sucks bottom line they only dropped the price to move out old product just to jack the price back up.

[Grem]

Actually Sony said there was some miscommunication, and that they wont be phasing out the 60gb.

[Aero 1]

Actually Sony said there was some miscommunication, and that they wont be phasing out the 60gb.

wrong. from the main man himself. at 1:45 Kaz says once its gone its gone.

http://atvs.vg.no/?id=10235

[Grem]

Yeah that was the miscommunication, Sony has stated that Kaz was incorrect.

[KakTheInfected]

And Kaz *is* Sony...so...there you go.

[Grem]

This is gonna be last time I say this, THE 60GB IS NOT BEING PHASED OUT.

[MrBogey]

They've been running this all today. what it is, is that they're not making any more. Don't worry. There's well over 2 million of them in the supply pipe. You'll have a couple of months before they run out. But once they do they're going to make the 80GB (non-EE) version the standard 500$ model.

So if you want full backwards compatibility versus 88% backwards compatibility it's just a matter of spending the 500$ now or later.

[Salem]

I hate the bacwards compatible list for 360. I have like 9 games im waiting to play and they only update the list like every 4 or 5 months with only 7 or 8 new games. Most of the games they add are crap kids games. I want MVP 05 and Men of Valor.MVP was a huge seller ad they ignore it.

[BIV]

I hate the bacwards compatible list for 360. I have like 9 games im waiting to play and they only update the list like every 4 or 5 months with only 7 or 8 new games. Most of the games they add are crap kids games. I want MVP 05 and Men of Valor.MVP was a huge seller ad they ignore it.


http://www.xbox.com/en-US/games/backwardcompatibilitygameslist.htm

They added lots of good titles in the last update. (great to see morrowind on the list) Remember they have just a couple of guys having to rewrite thousands of lines of code for every game they add.

[Slayback]

I hate the bacwards compatible list for 360. I have like 9 games im waiting to play and they only update the list like every 4 or 5 months with only 7 or 8 new games. Most of the games they add are crap kids games. I want MVP 05 and Men of Valor.MVP was a huge seller ad they ignore it.

Yeah. That's why I bought a next gen console, so I can play all my old games. BC is not a main selling point. New, fresh games are. 360's got them coming by the holidays and Sony may have 1 or 2.

Have fun playing Mass Effect, Halo 3, and VF5 online this fall.....oh, wait that'll be me. Sorry bro.

[Sct Ptersns Twn]

Have fun playing Mass Effect, Halo 3, and VF5 online this fall.....oh, wait that'll be me. Sorry bro.

:clap::clap::clap:

Me too!

[Grem]

I will be playing those games too though, Cause I have a 360 and a PS3 ,which is the only place you will find Metal Gear Solid 4(but of course because its not coming out on 360 you will call it "over rated" and that you dont want it anyway)

[Beeman99]

I will be playing those games too though, Cause I have a 360 and a PS3 ,which is the only place you will find Metal Gear Solid 4(but of course because its not coming out on 360 you will call it "over rated" and that you dont want it anyway)

MGS sucks cock. I have a PS3 as well as a 360, but I wouldn't waste money on another MGS game, I'd rather play solitare.

[Dopie Opie]

GREAT marketing by Sony...The unit is suffering from poor sales. Drop the price, then "leak" false information that the availability is limited. Try and create a feeding frenzy.

Rubes will fall for this hook line and sinker, people will be posting and blogging about it and Sony will get their sales going in the right directionm especially with all the technical problems that MS is having with 360.

Brilliant

[WoodenPlank]

TWO different sony execs have said the 60GB PS3 has been discontinued for NA. Theyve already stopped manufacturing. Sony PR disagrees. Sounds like PR is the shitbag in this case.

[Finger Younger]

The older ps3's are going to be superior though, for emulation reasons.

Really??? How do you know this? Do you have both PS3 systems for comparing.....I didn't think so.

What would 20gb of more HD space have to do with "emulation"? Oh, I get it, "emulation" is a big word for you & you just wanted to sound smart.

Another ass speaking out of his ass.....

[d0uche_n0zzle]

Another ass speaking out of his ass.....

Hey, isn't that what the Internet is for..."whaa"

[MrBogey]

Really??? How do you know this? Do you have both PS3 systems for comparing.....I didn't think so.

What would 20gb of more HD space have to do with "emulation"? Oh, I get it, "emulation" is a big word for you & you just wanted to sound smart.

Another ass speaking out of his ass.....

Uhhhhh.... He's absolutely right. The current PS3 model in the Us has the Emotion Engine built in. Essentially Sony wired in a PS2 into the PS3. It works for almost every game that ever came out (with at worse a few sound and video processing issues). the new one will not have the ship in it and will use software emulation. That gives at best 88% (according to Sony) compatibility.

You're ironically speaking out of your ass on this.

[WoodenPlank]

Damn, Bogey beat me to it.

Its all just more sony backpeddling. The price drop may have helped alot. Now that we know its just a fire sale, theyve gone back to having shot themselves in the foot.

[Finger Younger]

Uhhhhh.... He's absolutely right. The current PS3 model in the Us has the Emotion Engine built in. Essentially Sony wired in a PS2 into the PS3. It works for almost every game that ever came out (with at worse a few sound and video processing issues). the new one will not have the ship in it and will use software emulation. That gives at best 88% (according to Sony) compatibility.

You're ironically speaking out of your ass on this.

'Emulation' only effects "Backward Compatible" games.....who is buying a PS3 and not using it 99.9% of the time for native PS3 games?

As far as I am concerned the only PS2 title worth holding onto is......SC Chaos Theory!

[MrBogey]

'Emulation' only effects "Backward Compatible" games.....who is buying a PS3 and not using it 99.9% of the time for native PS3 games?

As far as I am concerned the only PS2 title worth holding onto is......SC Chaos Theory!

Doesn't matter. He was right.

Though many are using it to replace the PS2 they sold in order to get a PS3 for 400$.

[IBrokeMyLegDude]

They've been running this all today. what it is, is that they're not making any more. Don't worry. There's well over 2 million of them in the supply pipe. You'll have a couple of months before they run out. But once they do they're going to make the 80GB (non-EE) version the standard 500$ model.

So if you want full backwards compatibility versus 88% backwards compatibility it's just a matter of spending the 500$ now or later.
So, the one out now is better for PS 2 games?

I am on the fence about buying a PS 3. I jsut don't know if I should wait.

[IBrokeMyLegDude]

'Emulation' only effects "Backward Compatible" games.....who is buying a PS3 and not using it 99.9% of the time for native PS3 games?

As far as I am concerned the only PS2 title worth holding onto is......SC Chaos Theory!
There are not many PS 3 games out yet. So, you can play some of the older ones until they catch up

[MrBogey]

So, the one out now is better for PS 2 games?

I am on the fence about buying a PS 3. I jsut don't know if I should wait.

http://www.us.playstation.com/Support/CompatibleStatus

you can verify the status of your PS2/PS1 games against their list. But yeah, the current 60GB model is better for playing PS2/PS1 games.

[Grem]

I have a european PS3 and all the ps2 games i have work fine.

[HumpX]

keep in mind you can upgrade the PS3 HD with any off-the-shelf drive.

[Barely Legal]

Also keep in mind that the Guitar Hero guitar peripheral for the PS2 won't work on the PS3. That's the only reason I still have my PS2 attached to my TV.

[Jerry1]

Seems Sony is pulling the old switcheroo on us. They dropped the price of the PS3 to $499 only to end up saying that once they're gone, they're gone. Then they are releasing the 80GB (with Motorstorm) at $599.
If you wanna get your PS3, now's the time!

Sony to phase out $500 PlayStation 3 By Scott Hillis
Mon Jul 16, 7:32 PM ET



SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - Sony Corp. (6758.T) plans to phase out the cut-priced $499 model of its PlayStation 3 video game machine, leaving only a higher capacity $599 model for sale in the United States, the company said on Monday.


The revelation undid some of the praise Sony won from the gaming industry last week for its 17 percent price cut on the machine, a move seen as leveling the playing field with Microsoft Corp.'s (Nasdaq:MSFT - news) Xbox 360 console.

But one analyst said Sony had left the door open to further price cuts, saying another would almost certainly happen when the cheaper PlayStation 3 sells out.

Sony dropped the price on the PS3, which comes with a 60-gigabyte hard drive and high-definition Blu-ray DVD player, by $100 last week in a bid to boost sales of the console by passing on lower costs onto consumers.

It also said it would launch a new model featuring a hard drive with 33 percent more capacity -- 80 gigabytes -- and a copy of its off-road racing game "MotorStorm" in August.

A company spokesman said Sony would sell the $500 version until "supplies of that unit are depleted," estimated to be months after the August debut of the new, pricier model.

"We have ample inventory to meet the immediate needs of consumers in this territory for several months to come," Dave Karraker said in an e-mailed response to questions.

"We won't be making any further announcements regarding our PS3 model hardware strategy in North America until the 60GB model is exhausted and market conditions are evaluated," Karraker said.

The statement confirmed remarks by David Reeves, president of Sony Computer Entertainment Europe, carried last week on gaming news Web site GamesIndustry.biz saying the 60-gigabyte model would be discontinued.

Gaming circles voiced disappointment in the development with popular blog Joystiq.com saying it amounted to more of a "clearance sale" than an actual price cut.

Wedbush Morgan analyst Michael Pachter said in a research note that Sony had an estimated 2 million to 3 million 60-gigabyte models in inventory and that once they were sold out, it would lower the price on the 80-gigabyte version.

"Although we think that Sony's public relations gaffe was unfortunate, we do not believe that the company has ill intent, and we expect the $499 price point to be maintained until early next year, when the 80GB model will likely by cut again to $399," Pachter said.

The PS3 lags the Xbox and Nintendo Co. Ltd.'s (7974.OS) Wii console in sales. The Xbox, which launched in November 2005, has sold 5.6 million units in the United States through May of this year.

The $250 Wii, with its unique motion-sensing controller, has become a surprise hit, selling 2.8 million units in just seven months after its November 2006 launch, compared to the PS3's 1.4 million units in that time.

Microsoft's Xbox 360 comes in three models priced from $300 to $480. The most expensive model, the Elite, comes with a 120-gigabyte hard drive but lacks the PS3's high-definition DVD player, built-in wireless technology and bundled game.

[ZeoVGM]

The PS2 had a price drop 8 months after launch.

No, it didn't.

The PS2's first price drop was a year and a half after it launched.

[MrBogey]

Ok...checked it out. I was going off of what I was reading from others as I didn't own a PS2. It must have been a Brit who I got it from as Britain got a cut 8 months out but yea, the US got a cut at a year and a half out and Japan got one at a year out.

[BlackNinja]

I was going off of what I was reading from others as I didn't own a PS2.
bogey, i can understand you liking sony and blu ray, but jesus, at least tell me you owned psx, your staunch defense of them would at least be based on past experience. you missed out on good shit if not

[MrBogey]

bogey, i can understand you liking sony and blu ray, but jesus, at least tell me you owned psx, your staunch defense of them would at least be based on past experience. you missed out on good shit if not

I've said it before. The first Sony gaming device I bought was a PSP a couple months before the PS3. I bought the PS3 mainly for the Blu-ray and ability to play a few games that my fiance and I liked from the PS2. I saw back then that it was a good deal in terms of ability and that Blu-ray had the studio support to do well. So far I've been proven right.

I never got into PS1 games except for Wing Commander and Resident Evil. I went from NES to Genesis to PC gaming.

[Hank]

Everyone knew that the PS# was going to be outrageously priced. But everyone bought them anyway. We who don't have a PS3 yet will dish out the $500 or $600 bucks for the 80GB anyway. It sucks but our wallets and hard cah are in their hands....:fight6::arrrh:

[LAX]

August what 11th...And I just picked up a 60GB...

[MrBogey]

Look...it's September 6th...60GB PS3's are still available. Imagine that.

[LZMF1]

i just picked up a 250 gig 2.5" SATA notebook HD and swapped out my original 60 gig. my only problem is that i have to redownload all of the games i had on the original, luckily sony doesn't charge you to redownload them.

[ZeoVGM]

Look...it's September 6th...60GB PS3's are still available. Imagine that.

Okay, honestly dude. Do you purposely try to sound pathetic or what?

Because you bumped a month old thread to make yourself look like an ass.

Sony said a couple weeks ago that they had no 60 gigs left in warehouses. That everything they had was out on the market.

Do you realize the fact that you can still find 60 gigs is because they're not selling? It's pretty simple. Sony said they would be gone because they thought the "price drop" would help more than it did.

[MrBogey]

Okay, honestly dude. Do you purposely try to sound pathetic or what?

Because you bumped a month old thread to make yourself look like an ass.

Sony said a couple weeks ago that they had no 60 gigs left in warehouses. That everything they had was out on the market.

Do you realize the fact that you can still find 60 gigs is because they're not selling? It's pretty simple. Sony said they would be gone because they thought the "price drop" would help more than it did.

I'm being a cock because that's what everyone else here does.

Sony says? Give me a link to Sony saying it.

[ZeoVGM]

I'm being a cock because that's what everyone else here does.

Sony says? Give me a link to Sony saying it.

http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=7004&Itemid=2

You've already proven time and time again you argue about things without actually knowing what you're talking about, so at this point you should just trust I'm right.

[BCH]

I still don't get arguing over game systems...

Is this like when ford truck owners have a calvin pissing on a chevy logo?

[Aero 1]

http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=7004&Itemid=2

You've already proven time and time again you argue about things without actually knowing what you're talking about, so at this point you should just trust I'm right.

his stupidity knows no bounds.

[MrBogey]

http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=7004&Itemid=2

You've already proven time and time again you argue about things without actually knowing what you're talking about, so at this point you should just trust I'm right.

I think this proves you don't understand how big the supply channel really is. They announced they had shipped 6 million units before they announcd the discontinuation of the 60GB model. At the time they had sold far less than that. Just like MS has announced that they've shipped a couple million more than they've sold.

The fiction here is "there won't be any available after July".

And you proved me wrong about a game I don't have for a system I never played on. Big deal. This thread is just a big glaring example of how 360 fanboys like to jump on the PS3 and badmouth it without getting their basic facts together.

[MrBogey]

his stupidity knows no bounds.

Pfff... you're the guy who said fiber can't make any bends. And you supposedly work with the stuff. Damned Nick Burns wannabe.

[Aero 1]

Pfff... you're the guy who said fiber can't make any bends. And you supposedly work with the stuff. Damned Nick Burns wannabe.

no stupid, i said the verizon fios fiber cant make any bends, which it cant. but since you spend all your life on a computer and not having a life, you said it can.

after that thread at the beginning of the year, in july it was JUST developed. so, it still cant until its out of the market. so use the search function stupid to porve yourself wrong again.

http://www.engadget.com/2007/07/24/corning-develops-bendable-fiber-optic-cable/

so stop reaching idiot, because everyone here knows you are jackass.

[BCH]

Have you boys checked out wackbag's cool Ignore function?

[MrBogey]

Dummy, Corning developed a super-flexible fiber strand. Fiber has always had flexible properties. But putting knots into it or doing hard 180 degree turns was not possible. The whole purpose of an LGX is to spool the fiber into small loops for safe storage of splices.

Fiber can't bend? Then how the hell do they get it from one office to another without putting bends into it? At a house they loop the stuff and leave a ton of slack.

It's amusing that you pattle on about the stuff. If you want I could take a picture of fiber that is flexed around a snowshoe just to show how wrong you are. Hell, go look outside at a fiber strand and you'll see them in the air. Or I could walk 5 minutes from where I'm at and take an actual picture of actual fiber bending around a splice case.

How about this. Order a DDM-2000 from Verizon into your small apartment. All you need is the cash. They'll set the fiber into the space that you're saying it's impossible to reach.

Dude, just get a job at a Circuit City so you can snowjob people who aren't in the industry.

[BCH]

The fiber in the rear of my ONT is in a pretty tight circle.

[Monstercloud]

The fiber in the rear of my ONT is in a pretty tight circle.

http://img44.exs.cx/img44/8877/wackyhorn3ci.jpg

[BCH]

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a370/mrthermonuclear/coiledfiber.jpg

Behold the miracle??

Coiled Fiber?

and somehow i'm able to post this...

http://img44.exs.cx/img44/8877/wackyhorn3ci.jpg

did I say something wacky?

[Aero 1]

Dummy, Corning developed a super-flexible fiber strand. Fiber has always had flexible properties. But putting knots into it or doing hard 180 degree turns was not possible. The whole purpose of an LGX is to spool the fiber into small loops for safe storage of splices.

Fiber can't bend? Then how the hell do they get it from one office to another without putting bends into it? At a house they loop the stuff and leave a ton of slack.

It's amusing that you pattle on about the stuff. If you want I could take a picture of fiber that is flexed around a snowshoe just to show how wrong you are. Hell, go look outside at a fiber strand and you'll see them in the air. Or I could walk 5 minutes from where I'm at and take an actual picture of actual fiber bending around a splice case.

How about this. Order a DDM-2000 from Verizon into your small apartment. All you need is the cash. They'll set the fiber into the space that you're saying it's impossible to reach.

Dude, just get a job at a Circuit City so you can snowjob people who aren't in the industry.

First you bump an old thread with a stupid comment, and Zeo makes you look like an ass. I laugh like everyone else on every thread at you and then you attack me and bring up a thread from the beggining of the year where YOU said verizon fibre CAN do hard turns. Me, like everyone else who has verizon fios pointed and laughed at you becasue thats not true. looping/bending and hard turns around corners are a whole different animal. All i pointed out to you that fverizon fibre cant make hard turns. Stick the fucking topic that you brought up.

Go ahead, call verizon see if the fibre leaving their building is doing a hard turn? see if they have this magical fibre strands doing 90 degrees? so you even have fucking fibre anything in Lousiana? if not, shut the fuck up. someone here already posted a pic of their home fibre installation not doing a fucking hard turn. stick to the topic that you were proven wrong in stupid.

if you try to make yourself look better, quit your stupid factory job, leave your moms basement and get a life because everyone on this board laughs at you. you must love getting no respect from anyone here because you dont get any.

[Beeman99]

wow, Aero and Bogey don't like one another. I say ban them both.

And back to the topic at hand. Who care's if the 60GB PS3 is still available, if it's not big enough, buy a bigger drive and put it in. I'm sure Sony had a shitload of 60GB PS3's in stock, when they originally made the announcement, so who really gives a fuck if they are still being sold

[HumpX]

Vicious flaming over fiber strand.....thats what I love about WB.....the variety!

[Monstercloud]

Oh damn! You've been pwned!

[MrBogey]

It's kind of funny how you think BCH's pic supports you.

Verizon's problem with getting MDU's FiOS is more of a facility management problem than a fiber placement issue. There are thousands of office suites in office buildings all around America that are designed no different than an apartment and they can get fiber set-up to them.

Fuck, how big is a fiber snowshoe? Not very. You think they can fit that fiber spool in a small box but they can't get it into an apartment?

Verizon just doesn't want to put 30 optical network units in a closet on a single floor or set a fiber to each apartment. It's extremely labor intensive. In a project that's already costing an arm and a leg it's not something they want to do.

But actually pushing a fiber into an apartment? Nowhere near impossible.

Here...a quick google link on the thumb rule for the minimum fiber bend radius:
http://www.atis.org/tg2k/_minimum_bend_radius.html

Just get back to your cubicle. I'm the son of a fiber splicer and have been around this stuff since I was a kid and work around it every day.

[MrBogey]

and I bumped the post because it proves how mindnumbingly wrong you are about things.

It's September.

The 60GB PS3 is still available in the US.

Though I'd love it if they weren't. It would mean they've sold more than 6 million worldwide. Which wouldn't be bad since it took the 360 till October of it's first year to sell that (according to the wiki entry)

[LZMF1]

ok kids....back on track.


am i the only one who bothered to upgrade their HD in their PS3? i figured it's a safe bet if sony keeps making full PS3 games downloadable.


also....mrbobey....are you a coon ass?

[MrBogey]

also....mrbobey....are you a coon ass?

Not really.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/1e/Coonass2.jpg

[LZMF1]

just curious....good buddy of mine lives in white castle, LA and he's got an RCA sticker on his truck.



and while reading your quote i realised i can't spell for shit it's "bogey" not "bobey"

[Sam_Adams]

ok kids....back on track.


am i the only one who bothered to upgrade their HD in their PS3? i figured it's a safe bet if sony keeps making full PS3 games downloadable.


also....mrbobey....are you a coon ass?

Did you install one of those laptop hard drives? I thought about doing it but I will wait until my warranty expires just in case :)

Plus it will suck losing my 10GB worth of shit that I had put onto the PS3, like all of the music.

[Monstercloud]

and I bumped the post because it proves how mindnumbingly wrong you are about things.

Or maybe you are just a douchy cunt and need to nit pick at things so people can put their hands in their pockets, kick the dirt, turn and walk away..

Just sayin... :action-sm

Wavey makes it ok, right?

[LZMF1]

Did you install one of those laptop hard drives? I thought about doing it but I will wait until my warranty expires just in case :)

Plus it will suck losing my 10GB worth of shit that I had put onto the PS3, like all of the music.
indeed i did

i figured that if i needed to have anything done to it under warranty i'd pop in the original HD before sending it back. it's a very easy thing to do.

[BCH]

You two will have to forgive me as I have come in in the middle of this thing and I really don't get the tenor of the argument at hand. It seems to me that indeed, there is a minimum radius to which you can bend a fiber optic cable and that does not allow for very tight turns in the cable. However, being in a position to be in charge of several wire and cable installers at any given time and being quite familiar with wiring best practices, I can say that it's never a good idea to make a hard 90 degree bend with any wire or cable of any kind which is intended to carry large amounts of data. Kinking a piece of coax reduces the distance between the center conductor and the outer shield and damages the inner insulating layer and therefore should be avoided, likewise, Cat5e cable is manufactured and twisted in a very controlled manner and kinks in the cable throw off tolerences therein. At best it could be said that the minimum radius for a bend in Cat5e is much smaller than that of fiber but you still need to be careful if you want to move maximum throughput.

My reasons for posting in this particular thread however go beyond discussing minimum radii of bends in fiber if you all get my drift...

[Joe Avezzano]

Vicious flaming over fiber strand.....thats what I love about WB.....the variety!

I got a chuckle out of that. Here I am on a beautiful football evening readingn two strangers argue about something I know nothing about. Can't get that on G4 I guess...