Police taser an autistic kid playing in traffic. Easiest perp ever.

[MJMANDALAY]

TUSTIN, Calif. — Sheriff's officials defended their use of a Taser stun gun to subdue an autistic teenager who left a social services center where he was being treated.

"It was necessary," sheriff's spokesman Jim Amormino said in defense of the use of a Taser stun gun to subdue 15-year-old Taylor Karras.

He said the teen was running in and out of traffic and is lucky to be alive.

"If that were your son, would you want him Tased or hit by a car?" Amormino asked.

The teenager bolted from a social services center in Westminster on Monday and had walked 15 miles when sheriff's deputies received a call of someone running in and out of traffic on busy Newport Avenue. Sheriff's Lt. Larry Jones said a deputy fired the Taser after a second car had to swerve.

The teen was home with his parents Tuesday, uninjured and no charges were filed. But his parents said they believed deputies overreacted.

"They should have been on alert that there was a missing autistic teenager in the area," William Karras said.

Taser use by police drew national attention this week after video surfaced on the Internet of police shocking a university student in Florida who persistently questioned Sen. John Kerry during a forum and refused to yield the microphone to others. The incident generated a fierce debate about free speech, use of force and the motives of the student, a known prankster.

University of Florida President Bernie Machen said the use of the Taser, with the student yelling, "Don't Tase me, bro!" was "regretful." He requested a state probe of campus police actions and placed two officers on leave.

In Ohio, another police officer was on administrative leave Thursday after video taken from his cruiser showed him jolting a woman with a Taser gun at least twice after she was handcuffed, police and city administrators said.

Patrolman Richard Kovach's report said the 38-year-old woman, who had been ordered out of a bar, kicked at a rear window and tried to climb into the front seat once she was inside the cruiser.

"I deployed a second Taser cartridge into her and the violent turbulent action stopped immediately," the report said. "I then requested a car with a cage for transport."

She was again Tasered during the transfer to the second car when she fell and was knocked unconscious by the impact; an ambulance took her to a hospital, the report on the Sept. 2 arrest said.

Simply because someone is hit with a Taser while handcuffed may not be against policy, said Warren Law Director Greg Hicks, citing the example of someone kicking out windows of a cruiser.

Taser stun guns fire electrically charged darts that carry 50,000 volts for several seconds, temporarily immobilizing their targets. According to Taser International Inc., about 11,000 U.S. law enforcement agencies use Taser technology.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,297488,00.html

[martianvirus]

At some point we need to decide as a society that a good old fashion police beating is better then a tazing. Enough with the tazers.

[Sidekick Dave]

I think that these cops who were inferior in High School now have taken a job in which they can go around and bully the fuck out of people. This kid has had it hard enough, so he has to be humiliated? Enraging I tell you all!

I understand that officers had to be put in this situation to save this young man from hurting himself as well as others, but the right thing would have been to get in the vacinity and escort him back into the vehicle peacefully. Tasering this kid just shows how corrupt the Police have become.

[Stormrider666]

Just love how since some whiny douche bag college kid got tazed, all of the sudden you're seeing stories about cops and whether tazers are being misused.

[martianvirus]

Just love how since some whiny douche bag college kid got tazed, all of the sudden you're seeing stories about cops and whether tazers are being misused.
It's not just that kid. There is a story about cops an their tazers every other week.

[WhiteHonkyDevil]

I understand that officers had to be put in this situation to save this young man from hurting himself as well as others, but the right thing would have been to get in the vacinity and escort him back into the vehicle peacefully. Tasering this kid just shows how corrupt the Police have become.

Have you ever dealt with an autistic kid when they get violent? I know they're not waterhead-like retarded, but they can let loose with some serious retard strength. Better to quickly drop him and get him out of there, rather than have to deal with him hulking up and breaking some bones.

[abudabit]

I think that these cops who were inferior in High School now have taken a job in which they can go around and bully the fuck out of people. This kid has had it hard enough, so he has to be humiliated? Enraging I tell you all!

I understand that officers had to be put in this situation to save this young man from hurting himself as well as others, but the right thing would have been to get in the vacinity and escort him back into the vehicle peacefully. Tasering this kid just shows how corrupt the Police have become.

I can't tell if you were being sarcastic or not. I hope you were.

[Stalker2]

I`ve seen up to 3 nurses,a Dr. and myself have to restrain my autistic son and that was when he was about 7 years old.

[Dopie Opie]

Autistic and retarded are basically the same thing, just a "nicer" way of putting it.

No one is ever classified as retarded nowadays.

[Glenn Dandy]

force should be used to protect officers lives in danger... not as a means to be a lazy fuck.

Ohh, I don't feel like dealing with this whiney college kid BBAAAAHNT!

Ohh, I dont feel like stopping traffic n dealing with an autistic kid BAHNT!

in my opinion cops arent adult enough to have tazers. bunch of short toughguys who got pants infront of the girls locker room with tazer guns.


AGAIN I BLAME POLITICAL CORRECTNESS.

cops should get hired causer their smart, big and can handle unruly individuals. because of pc guidlines these fucking midget retard fat cops need weapons to do their job.


Once again PC takes another innocent victum....this poor kid.

they are cops block the road assholes. ya know those lighyt things on the roof? fuckin nobs.

[Glenn Dandy]

I`ve seen up to 3 nurses,a Dr. and myself have to restrain my autistic son and that was when he was about 7 years old.


3 nurses and a doctor..... arent cops.


If a police force needs electricity to handle an autistic kid... mayby we should hand them out to the nurses, teachers and aids as well....c,mon... my sons 12 tries to rip my throat out daily... but ya know what? I can kick his monkey ass.

[Stalker2]

You do not have any experience with violent autistic children,I do.

[d0uche_n0zzle]

You do not have any experience with violent autistic children,I do.


President GD does have a child with autism, sir.

[martianvirus]

Glenn wins this round.

[Stalker2]

My son was put in the hospital for severe aggression attacking my wife myself and trying to strangle my daughter.I did`nt know your son was autistic
Glenn,sorry about the misunderstanding but my son is described as extremely violent.

[Dopie Opie]

Today is the first day I have agreed with El Presidente, twice, no less.

A law enforcement officer should be able to restrain a retarded teenager. Two men must be able to. If they cannot then how can they protect and serve.

I think it comes down to political correctness as well. It does not "look" as bad to taser a retard or fat black chick than to physically restrain them. I have a friend who is a trainer at the Police Academy for the NYPD and he says that the requirements are a joke compared to 10-15 years ago.

You have two types of cops nowadays.

1. HS kids who were abused and look at this as revenge
2. Lazy fucks who see it as an easy pay check and pension.

Sorry, but that is my view, as the son of a retired NYPD sgt.

[Dopie Opie]

My son was put in the hospital for severe aggression attacking my wife myself and trying to strangle my daughter.I did`nt know your son was autistic
Glenn,sorry about the misunderstanding but my son is described as extremely violent.

As stated earlier, you wife and daughter are not law enforcement officials. They are not trained to protect the public. And if your son is that uncontrollable I hope and pray that you have him admitted somewhere that will protect him and the general public.

A good friend of mine just had his son sent to a "school" in Albany because he got too big and strong to be trusted. It was not easy for him, but once the boy was able to over power mom, it had to be done.

That is for everyone's safety.

Good luck and God bless

[Stalker2]

Let me state this:
I did`nt say anywhere that I believe autistic kids should be tasered.I was saying how strong they can be from experience.2 of the 3 nurses were men and this was on the childrens psyche ward also the Doctor who was a guy and me a construction worker holding him down while he was biting them.After years of drugs he is better now but has been put in a 24 hour care home out of my state.The ex lives down there with my daughter.

[Dopie Opie]

Mental disabilities are a terrible thing. I have stated here a few times that my oldest son has a mild case of CP, and that is ONLY physical and slight at that. Some of his "shortcomings" were corrected about this time last year and he gets around better than ever.

I do not know what I would do if I had to worry about the safety of my family or my child at the hand of my own flesh and blood.

I would hate to not be able to communicate with my child. I would hate to have to worry who would care for him/her after I died.

I said it before and I will say it again, with all sincerity, God Bless.

[Your_Moms_Box]

I thought that tasers were supposed to be a non-lethal alternative to shooting someone.

I don't think they should be used unless you are willing to shoot the person with your gun.



Fucking cops are getting away with way too much these days.

[HummerTuesdays]

It's not just that kid. There is a story about cops an their tazers every other week.

You're right. That should no longer carry tazers, and shot to kill instead. ;)

[sniper2323]

You're right. That should no longer carry tazers, and shot to kill instead. ;)

:clap:

Beat me to it.. Take away.. OC-10, PR-24, handcuffs, batons, harsh words, etc.. arm them only with a 12 gauge shotguns with 00 buckshot.

I have been tazed with a real tazer when I was on the force, it was required to be able to carry, the same with OC-10.

I will say this, I would MUCH rather be tazed the OC'ed.

On the other note, you guys are right, every cop should be disarmed, not allowed to have any tools to do thier job, because if they are cops they should be able to handle any situation with the mear threat they might show up.:icon_roll

[Cromwell]

I too have a son with Autism.

He's only 11 years old and is *not* violent in any way.

I would hate to think some lazy ass cops who can't think think of any other solution other than to taze a kid who just needs some help - would do that to him.

I have to agree that it appears cops today are using these taser guns waaaay too much. I guess because it doesn't kill the "perp" then its ok.

Fuck that.

How about some of these fat donut-eating, power-tripping loads actually get their asses in shape and learn to subdue someone the old fashion way. By holding them down.

They make it too easy for cops to intimidate with their guns. They don't have to get in shape.

Already big and strong for an 11 year old - I hope and pray my kids develops greater strenth. Hell, he needs *some* kind of advantage, because he's at a serious disadvantage is so many other ways.

It really breaks my heart to read stories like this.

[Zona992006]

I`ve seen up to 3 nurses,a Dr. and myself have to restrain my autistic son and that was when he was about 7 years old.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Autistic and retarded are basically the same thing, just a "nicer" way of putting it.

No one is ever classified as retarded nowadays."

Wow, I don't think you two are on the same page on this one.

[HummerTuesdays]

How about some of these fat donut-eating, power-tripping loads actually get their asses in shape and learn to subdue someone the old fashion way. By holding them down.

Unfortunately, that lead to a lot of police brutality law suits. It's a no-win situation.

[weakside]

I too work with kids that have developmental disabilities including Autism, and although I was not there I am guessing the right decision was made here.

I give all the respect in the world to those on this message board that have Autistic children but in all fairness it is real easy for you to say, "Just grab him." You know what your child is and is not capable of, police don't.

Police not only have to be concerned with this child's welfare, they also have to be concerned with preventing accidents (possibly fatal ones), protecting themselves, and protecting safety of other people in the town. And they have to make a decision in a short amount of time.

This kid was acting irrationally and put himself and others in a dangerous situation. He didn’t mean to, it was part of his disability, but the fact is he did. Public welfare was at stake as well as this kids life. I'm sure he will be just fine.

[Glenn Dandy]

#1 my son is as violent as autistic kidsget,,, four broken noses and lots of bruises i can attest he has given me.

there is NO DOUGHT in my mind this could of been handled differently.... watch COPS mayby a third of the time on a televised show cops act rationaly..especially woman cops jesus christ,, bull dykes that love every minute of man handling a guy to make their pretend balls grow.

Stryker I dont know what kind ofSpider monkey strenght your kid has but you should,t say what you said... my son is definatly stronger than a reg kid his mom @ 12 cant control him and he fucks her up... but hes 12.. DUDE!

My son usualy hurts me cause he is sneaky,,, he will sneak up on me and sucker punch me. or headbut me when i try to hug him. kick me in the face while tieing his shoe... shit like that.... but full on me lookin I p3own him.


and I cant imagine a tougher kid... hes a mean motherfucker. just sayin..

cops , and I hate to put all cops in this category... but, I would say atleast 75% ofcops are cowboy assholes who use way to much abuse of power.

I,m 100% behind and thank the 25% doing their dificult job.Autistic kids dont have guns, knives,ability to think rationaly aboutgrabbing the cops gun or using it.


In my opinion,,, bettertrained and non lazy cops could of just as easily blockedthe road with their patrol cars and subdued this kid easily.Man If i had the advantage of just handcuffs my life would becake... So speaking from a dad of an EXTREMLY VIOLENT autistic kid...


These cops were total pussies.

[martianvirus]

:clap:

Beat me to it.. Take away.. OC-10, PR-24, handcuffs, batons, harsh words, etc.. arm them only with a 12 gauge shotguns with 00 buckshot.

I have been tazed with a real tazer when I was on the force, it was required to be able to carry, the same with OC-10.

I will say this, I would MUCH rather be tazed the OC'ed.

On the other note, you guys are right, every cop should be disarmed, not allowed to have any tools to do thier job, because if they are cops they should be able to handle any situation with the mear threat they might show up.:icon_roll

You need to learn to read. Nobody said 'disarm the cops'. All we are saying is that some cops are abusing the tazers. In fact, nobody even said take tazers away. We just want them used only when necessary.

:icon_roll:icon_roll:icon_roll:icon_roll<<Since you like them so much these are for you.:)

[Glenn Dandy]

I wanna demonstrate for that faggot cop how to do what I do all day everyday.,

without a fuckin tazer...I know chics in autistic schools tougher.

abuse of power plain n simple. and the subject is tough because cops have a tough job sometimes... but, I know it can be done... I know good cops.

that don't get a hardone hurting unthreatening people.

[Stalker2]

Glen,you can`t stop him when he flips out.He then goes into a rage biting his arms and wrists until they bleed and at one time I had to see him with his arms outstretched both completely swollen with bites and he had to be tethered to his bed a good deal of time in the childrens psyche ward.He broke one kids arm and anothers leg at the home he lives in and thats when he was doing better.Believe me you don`t know the hell I`ve been through with this and still today.

[sniper2323]

You need to learn to read. Nobody said 'disarm the cops'. All we are saying is that some cops are abusing the tazers. In fact, nobody even said take tazers away. We just want them used only when necessary.

:icon_roll:icon_roll:icon_roll:icon_roll<<Since you like them so much these are for you.:)

The thing is, that is almost always ends in that kind of statement.

I know there are bad cops out there, and more then once I've seen good cops get a bad rap, because the media gets the story wrong or slants it so that everyone wants the cops head.

Also, there have been alot of general statements made about cops (out of shape, lazy, blah blah blah). Law Enforcement is one of the thankless job 99% of the time. "There is never a cop around when you need one, and always one around when you don't want one". Here in my neck of the woods, the public is outraged because a guy got tazed who was mental, and refused commands and running from a building that was on fire. The media came down hard on the cops.. They forgot to mention he was yelling at the cops, he had fought with the cops aready, oh and one other point that is minor, he was the one that started the fire, but that is a minor point. In spokane, the cops, whom I don't care for as they are badge happy in my eyes, tazed a guy who was suicidal and was going to jump from a bridge. Well he jump as he was tazed and the media went after the cops saying he most likely would have lived if he wasn't tazed. They didn't need any proof, just a statement and BANG, it must be the cops fault.

So with all do respect, I do know how to read, and am fairly sure where this will turn as there has been a huge push to take tazers away from cops for a long time now.

Hope that clears it up

[DoucheMeister]

I vote lazy.

They could have just closed the road just as fast, then dealt with the kid.

[abudabit]

To all the pro-restraint people: Why is it so much more gentle to put someone in a restraint hold than tazer them? I would rather be tazed then put into a half nelson against the ground.





I vote lazy.

They could have just closed the road just as fast, then dealt with the kid.

Close the road for him when he's the one making the ruckus? You try closing a road in less than a minute. You're talking about endangering the public in order to protect the problem.

[WOWmagnet]

President GD does have a child with autism, sir. :icon_roll

You do not have any experience with violent autistic children,I do.
:haha7: :clap:

[abudabit]

The other thing, why should the police be forced to stand in the middle of traffic wrestling with an autistic when they can simply taze him? It doesn't make sense. It's not like they shot him with a bullet, they shot him with a tazer.

[martianvirus]

:icon_roll


:haha7: :clap:

Are you laughing because he didn't put a space after the comma? :huh:

[weakside]

Aside from my previous argument, we have the luxury of second guessing the cops because we know it is an Autistic child. The cops don't know if the kid is on drugs or just crazy.

I can't believe this is even a discussion. The cops potentially saved lives by tazering that kid.

[Glenn Dandy]

Glen,you can`t stop him when he flips out.He then goes into a rage biting his arms and wrists until they bleed and at one time I had to see him with his arms outstretched both completely swollen with bites and he had to be tethered to his bed a good deal of time in the childrens psyche ward.He broke one kids arm and anothers leg at the home he lives in and thats when he was doing better.Believe me you don`t know the hell I`ve been through with this and still today.

Yes I do...and I understand. Didn,t mean to come off like its easy. It's the hardest thing In my opinion any man can face.

Hang in there...

[Stalker2]

Thank you sir for understanding.

[Glenn Dandy]

People like us are the only ones who possibly could...


Just took my son down to the lake... smiling happy, then BAM,,, like a trance he started trying to kill me...then went completly crazy...It seems to me like a sort of siezure,,, where all his nerv endings in his body are simultaniouslky freaking out...
He bashed his knees in the road,,, smashed his head on the cement bridge.
no worse pain than watching someone you love more than life destroy theirown body because the pain they inflict is better than the autism they feel.

[Stalker2]

The hardest part is no one understands.

[Glenn Dandy]

The hardest part is no one understands.
They understand,,, they are just afraid. Out of site out of mind. compare it to a hippy that doesnt understand why GW goes to war.

They would rather look the otherway and not face boldreality..

Because sometimes its just fucking ugly,.

[Stalker2]

I meant alot of people don`t understand autism that their perception is that they are like "Rainman" or such.I feel for you bro and know the pain.I had similiar experiences with my son just driving somewhere then all of a sudden he goes into a fit of rage.

[Dopie Opie]

I have a ton of experience since I volunteer with a group that provides sports for disabled children. My son has a physical disability and we would have to watch these kids go off.

Imagine this scenario: I am bringing my son, who cannot walk all that well to play hockey with other disabled children. He would end up getting chased with foam hockey sticks by the other children. He would be falling all over the place. I felt like I was bringing my 5 year old son to be sacrificed.


We do not go anymore. although I still am a member of the board of directors

[CaraC]

I teach kids with autism who have severe behaviors... I have spoken to both Stalker2 AND Glenn Dandy about their children quite a bit because I do know what they both go through as similar children's teacher (but of course not as their parent, which is indeed quite different)... so I do have a VERY involved and passionate opinion about this incident with the boy playing in traffic.

One thing I will agree on is that autism varies WAY too much for any police officer to know what they were dealing with in regards to this kid. Like someone said earlier, they should have been aware that there was a missing teen with autism in the area. And though the cop had to act as quickly as possible to ensure the child's safety, I am sure that the people from the group home he was at AND his parents were waiting by the phone and should have been contacted to help handle this situation without having to use a tazer. Though the child may have severe aggressive behavior, a child with autism should not have had to endure being tazed... especially when it is so difficult for children with autism to build trust and communication with anyone and now here's a police officer, who I'm sure has been identified to the child as a safe person, administering physical pain. The way the autistic mind works, its very likely that even if he needs serious help in the future, he will not be looking for a police officer, even if the need is there.

Now sure, like I said before, I know the cop had to act quickly and that is why I think that if the cop was doing his job correctly he would know there was a missing child with autism and could have contacted someone to help him deal with this properly.

The child IS lucky that he wasn't hit by a car but it is perfectly understandable that the parents are upset about this. This was a far too forceful way of getting him out of the situation and was a lazy and uninformed way to deal with it.

[Stalker2]

Said very well. Thank you CaraC!:clap:

[HummerTuesdays]

People, you WEREN'T there, so stop assuming that they could block the road, that they could tackle the kid safely, that restraining him would work, that there were enough cops around to hold him down, etc. Let's start blaming what triggered the event: His cargivers. If the group home was that on top of things, how did the kid get out in the first place? You're all trashing the cops for tazing the kid. How about bashing the home for not securing things well enough to keep im from getting out? How about the home for not having enough supervision? How about the workers for not keeping an eye on the kid? My grandmother was in a home for people with alzheimers & related disease. An alarm would sound when the doors & windows were open. The gate had a magnetic lock with a code. Does anyone know if these safe guards were in place? I would think they would help contain the students a little better.

I really do hope that the next time this happens a cop doesn't use a tazer. Then I can sit back & listen to you all bitch about "excessive force." Or, hey, why did (s)he have to pull her gun & shoot the guy in the foot?

[abudabit]

I hope you all people who are so quick to give the police shit have to wrestle an autistic 17 year old in busy traffic. And I hope he's covered in jello.

[Glenn Dandy]

you two just dont get it..... but thats cool. And HT I will tell you this much... Atlkeast in this state NJ... these group homes money has been so cut back from the state( Corzine) even more cuts... they can barely staff.



i see one girl handling 4 sometimes 6 kids.

the situation is pathetic. Tax dollars I,m sure well spent somewhere else.... Mentaly ill weather it be on the streets, or in group homes get treated like trash in our system.

and It is very wrong.

As far as wrestling a 17year old autistic kid in Jello. you better get use to it....the statistics in NJ are 1 in 94 boys born will be Autistic...thats alot of kids.... and one just might be yours.

So try to understand the Autistics community trying to educate a bunch of dopes about what thereality of this epidemic is.... and the pure mass of people that will be autistic in the years to come...

this isnt your average waterhead rate guys....

Everyone needs to be educated on this fucking epidemic and especially police officers.


As Cara explained tazing an autistic kidcan cause serious issues.... some of these kids take years to make eye contact ... they dont want to interact with people... we force them too. to break them out from the shell...

Im sure a scarted kidin the roads last need is 50,000 volts. and a body slam with a knee in his head.


Let me just put it this way... I watch girls deal with these individuals everyday... So dont tell me this cunt cop needed to taz this kid...


trust me... I didn't have to be there... Im around them everyday.

Hey Cara how many tazers does your school have? What!!! none? how o how do you do it.


fuckin nigga please.Autistic kids arent actualy trying to hurt you... they are involuntarily stemming... if you restrain them mildly they usualy calm.


NO GUN? NO KNIFE? NO TAZERS ASSHOLES.

[abudabit]

So your idea of education is teaching officers that it's ok to tackle people in a busy street? I think I'm missing something. Would you have been happier if the kid got run over instead of tazed? Maybe it would have been kinder and gentler to face plant him in a submission hold? I don't understand what realistic alternative you are suggesting that would have been superior to a tazering.

[Glenn Dandy]

just grabbing him... no tackle involved. mild restraint is usualy affective.

I restrain my sons advances daily without harming him.


my son is so bad if i grab his punches the double jointed motherfucker flips his wrists inward and scratches me on the arms...

they are tough... but i dont go around tazing him. I'm a man.


Truth iswith these kids violence begets violence if you smile n calmly subdue them its usualy done..


but fight em? or hurt em? they smile a sick smile and try to kill you...


Passive restraint is how to resolve autistic violence.

TRUSTME.


I guarantee the tazing and usual cop treatment had this kid rabid.

[abudabit]

just grabbing him... no tackle involved. mild restraint is usualy affective.

I restrain my sons advances daily without harming him.


my son is so bad if i grab his punches the double jointed motherfucker flips his wrists inward and scratches me on the arms...

they are tough... but i dont go around tazing him. I'm a man.

Have you ever been in a situation where he was about to die from his own actions and you had to save him? Were you 'gentle' then?

Tazing is an effective tool and it was used with success in the incident. Boo-hoo, the kid got shocked for a few seconds. No injuries, no life threat, 2 minutes later he was probably back to normal.

Cops aren't out there to show off or protect feelings, they are out there to resolve safety problems. I think a man would do what it takes to save lives before thinking about the feelings of the source of the threat.

[Glenn Dandy]

I just explained what an educated cop on autism would and should do.

the only life really her in danger was the kids... and If he was close enough to taz him he was close enough to grab him too.

understand this... I see a cop screaming at a non verbal autistic kid commands...GET ON THE GROUND!! GET ON THE GROUND!!! BAHNT!

understand?

This is not a criminal threatening the officers life. this is a sick child. getting abused.


I see cops abuse mentaly ill people on " COPS" all the time and it really pisses me off. Some people dont understand their commands and they need to learn that. and deal with it differently.


As far as cops go I think they are idiots... They use way to much abuse of power... I have been approached by cops a completly innocent man... and treated like a fucking piece of shit.....Why? who the fuck are they to talk down to me? a productive citizen who did nothing wrong?

they need to learn people arent their fucking dogs to be fucked with..... going through a police acadamy and puting on a polyester suite doesn't make you better than anyone else.


They need to learn if they want respect ... to treat people with respect. Do you know how many innocent dudes are in jail cause some cowboy cop fucked with a guy till he snapped and fought back?

[abudabit]

It's a sick child in the middle of the street. He was abusing himself by putting his own life at risk, the police removed him from the situation. Problem solved.

The cops aren't out there to protect autistic kids' feelings, they are out there to protect autistic kids lives. The department of hugs is the fire department, not the police.

[Glenn Dandy]

The cops problem was solved right?


nice stance.... genius.

fuck the cops day,.... I care lil more bout the kid.


Mayby the cop should justtaz the speeder so he doesn't have to be bothered with the excuse storys... when you wake up your tickets on the windshield.


the fact you can act like this is lucky for you ... ignorence is bliss..... I hope you never have to learn as much as I was forced to in this erea.

good day sir.

[abudabit]

The cops problem was solved right?

The kids problem was solved. He is alive, which he probably wouldn't be if you were calling the shots. Genius.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that the threat of death over rides the threat of an owwie?


Now since you are getting pesonal let's continue down this road. You wouldn't act expediently and potentially harshly if your kid was playing in traffic? That makes you a shitty parent.

[Glenn Dandy]

because tazing takes longer than grabbing:)


think about it.


tazing is just easier. I stand by my initial statement that cop was a pussy. he was afraid.



All thefacts arent presented in the case but i remember hearing the word " ROAD" not highway, freeway... justa fuckin road...Do you stop for a policecar in the road? I do.... doesnt seem like it was necessary



by the same token do you taz a deaf person that didnt hear you yell stop?

[abudabit]

because tazing takes longer than grabbing:)


think about it.


tazing is just easier. I stand by my initial statement that cop was a pussy. he was afraid.

I take it you have never grappled with someone. Grappling can potentially take minutes and we are dealing with a situation in which every second counts. The cops can't take the risk that the kid doesn't put up a fight. They are in a life or death situation.

[WhiteHonkyDevil]

the only life really her in danger was the kids...

And anyone driving down the street at the time. And the police. But, you don't count them.


I see cops abuse mentaly ill people on " COPS" all the time and it really pisses me off. Some people dont understand their commands and they need to learn that. and deal with it differently.

Well, it happens all the time on TV, that must mean it's how every situation is handled. Let me guess...you've got a personal experience, right?

[/QUOTE] I have been approached by cops a completly innocent man... and treated like a fucking piece of shit.....Why? who the fuck are they to talk down to me? a productive citizen who did nothing wrong?[/QUOTE]

And there it is. I'm sure, based on your many posts, you immediately responded in a normal, respectful tone, and they just got pissed and beat you down for no reason.

they need to learn people arent their fucking dogs to be fucked with..... going through a police acadamy and puting on a polyester suite doesn't make you better than anyone else.

They need to learn if they want respect ... to treat people with respect. Do you know how many innocent dudes are in jail cause some cowboy cop fucked with a guy till he snapped and fought back?

And you have to understand that no matter what you think of them, they were actually there, and had to make decisions based on the situation they were given... not bitching on the internet days later.

[Glenn Dandy]

I take it you have never grappled with someone. Grappling can potentially take minutes and we are dealing with a situation in which every second counts. The cops can't take the risk that the kid doesn't put up a fight. They are in a life or death situation.
every second counts? Im picturing a goofy kid in the road.... theres not a person tied to the train tracks here.


park your patrol car across the road lights on... call backup... get the kid under control... no rush... no tazers.

no big deal... I figure some cowboy couldnt wait to whip out his lil toy.

thats how i see it.


we could both be wrong not enough info... but I'll bet I,m right.

[Glenn Dandy]

And anyone driving down the street at the time. And the police. But, you don't count them.




Well, it happens all the time on TV, that must mean it's how every situation is handled. Let me guess...you've got a personal experience, right?

I have been approached by cops a completly innocent man... and treated like a fucking piece of shit.....Why? who the fuck are they to talk down to me? a productive citizen who did nothing wrong?[/QUOTE]

And there it is. I'm sure, based on your many posts, you immediately responded in a normal, respectful tone, and they just got pissed and beat you down for no reason.



And you have to understand that no matter what you think of them, they were actually there, and had to make decisions based on the situation they were given... not bitching on the internet days later.[/QUOTE]

Face it before tazerswere around cops jobs were to grapple with criminals... Its their job.... Im glad they have tazers now... I wouldnt want to fight a 6'5 moolie that if he gets caught goes to jail ten years.

We are talking about an autistic kid in the road.... the point of the whole story is... Are these tazers getting out of hand? are they being turned to to easily,,, I think the answer to thatquestion is YES..... It,s a lazy way to subdue a person... If that person is a criminal,,, well fuck em... But tazing innocents without atleast first anylizing the situation is just cowardly and wrong.


you are trying to cover for this cop cause he was protecting the masses from this autistic kid...


weak.

[WhiteHonkyDevil]

Im picturing a goofy kid in the road....

Wait...you're "picturing"??? So, really, you have no fucking idea what actually happened. You just know the cops were wrong.


you are trying to cover for this cop cause he was protecting the masses from this autistic kid...
weak.

And you're trying to pretend you have all the answers, when you're really just as clueless as the rest of us.

[Glenn Dandy]

Its my guess...... your right.


wasn,t there. neither were you two..... but I'll still bet I,m right.;) lol


I'll bet I can even guess what the cop looked like.


guessin


White 5'6", mid 30's chubby.


Im off to go see if i can find a pic now.

[Glenn Dandy]

Quote from the 15 year old boy.

Taylor Karras, an autistic 15-year-old, walked down the street near his home in North Tustin next to the spot where Orange County Sheriff's deputies Tasered him.

"I gave up by doing this [hands behind his head], and then they Tasered me and I laid down, I got down. I was on the ground and they Tasered me again," said Karras.
Theres your hero's

[WhiteHonkyDevil]

Quote from the 15 year old boy.


Theres your hero's

Wow, the other articles I've seen seem to have the same quote, but a different lead in.

Taylor Karras was running in and out of traffic, but instead of being hit by a car, he was hit by 50,000 volts of electricity.

"I gave up by doing this and then they tasered me and I laid down, I got down," he said.

"I was on the ground and they tasered me again."

Hm. Go figure.

[Glenn Dandy]

He had his hands behind his head giving up when they tazered him.

thats all i need to hear..kinda shoots the whole having to grapple with a 15 year old theory to shit dont it.

cowboys.

[WhiteHonkyDevil]

Wait! This just in.

Amormino said Tustin police called the Sheriff's Department after a pedestrian reported a suspicious person. Taylor was pushing a shopping cart down Newport Avenue near La Loma Drive, near his home in North Tustin. With no money, he apparently had walked home.

Doris Karras said her son, who is 5 feet 10 and has a beard, looks older than 15.

Amormino said Taylor yelled something when approached by a deputy, then ran across Newport Avenue, causing two cars to swerve. It was then that a deputy shot him with a Taser gun.

The deputy handcuffed the youth to keep him out of traffic, Amormino said.

[Glenn Dandy]

Amormino said.the police spoksman?

I'll take the kids word;)

[WhiteHonkyDevil]

the police spoksman?

I'll take the kids word;)

I figured you would.

[Glenn Dandy]

:clap::clap::clap: One thing about Autistickids.. the concept of lieing is beyond their comprehension.

[HummerTuesdays]

Ok, I'm not reading this page 3 of back-and-forth because something really annoyed me. Glenn, I love ya, but you HAVE to put blame on the care givers. DON'T let them get away with the "waaaaa, they cut our funding" shit. Don't states have very strict requirements for staff to student ratios? And isn't an alarm system way more important than one more staffer that may be too busy taking breaks to watch your kid?

Cara mentioned earlier that the cop just *had* to know that there was a loose Autistic kid on the streets. Really? Before we had my grandmother in the home she wandered from the house. We weren't really sure how long she was out before my mother was able to inform the police. And since this kid was ABLE TO GET OUT, we have no idea just how long he was out before someone noticed & decided to call the police. Isn't there a chance that the cop got a call about a kid playing in the street, going nuts, before the police got that call that there might be an Autistic kid on the loose?

Yeah, there are ass hole cops out there, but I'm not sure this is one of them. He went to the police academy. He didn't get his bachelor's in developmental psych. He doesn't have a masters in Autism. Unlike Glenn's previous statement about case workers, the cop does NOT work with Autistic kids on a daily basis, and therefore does not know each kid's trigger, strenght, or propensity to seriously injure strangers.

Here's a tip: If you don't want the cops tazing your Autistic kid, make sure he/she has proper supervision.

Edit: Maybe I should have read this page. The kid is pretty communicative as far as my limited knowledge of Autism goes. He understands that the reporter wants him to re-count the incident. He should have been able to understand "stop!" "get out of the road!" I say he should have been tazed.

[sniper2323]

Ok, I'm not reading this page 3 of back-and-forth because something really annoyed me. Glenn, I love ya, but you HAVE to put blame on the care givers. DON'T let them get away with the "waaaaa, they cut our funding" shit. Don't states have very strict requirements for staff to student ratios? And isn't an alarm system way more important than one more staffer that may be too busy taking breaks to watch your kid?

Cara mentioned earlier that the cop just *had* to know that there was a loose Autistic kid on the streets. Really? Before we had my grandmother in the home she wandered from the house. We weren't really sure how long she was out before my mother was able to inform the police. And since this kid was ABLE TO GET OUT, we have no idea just how long he was out before someone noticed & decided to call the police. Isn't there a chance that the cop got a call about a kid playing in the street, going nuts, before the police got that call that there might be an Autistic kid on the loose?

Yeah, there are ass hole cops out there, but I'm not sure this is one of them. He went to the police academy. He didn't get his bachelor's in developmental psych. He doesn't have a masters in Autism. Unlike Glenn's previous statement about case workers, the cop does NOT work with Autistic kids on a daily basis, and therefore does not know each kid's trigger, strenght, or propensity to seriously injure strangers.

Here's a tip: If you don't want the cops tazing your Autistic kid, make sure he/she has proper supervision.

Edit: Maybe I should have read this page. The kid is pretty communicative as far as my limited knowledge of Autism goes. He understands that the reporter wants him to re-count the incident. He should have been able to understand "stop!" "get out of the road!" I say he should have been tazed.

I'm with ya. Glenn, I like alot of what you say, but I think you MIGHT be off the mark here. I am not saying the cop is right or wrong, like stated before, we were not there.

The thing to remember, is it is easy to 20/20 hind sight this. We don't know the REAL situation. We only get what the media wants us to know.

I know from my time, that cops are paid to serve and protect. I do not know this officers record, and I could very well be proved that this cop is in fact a scumbag, but I have my doubts. With most use of force, there will be an investigation. I know, I know by other cops, but you have to hope the system works, and if the cop is wrong he will be punished. But if he did the right thing, then I doubt we will hear much.

As the old saying goes, if it bleeds, it leads. I know there were alot of times when I was on the force, I would help change a tire for people, and I would never see it in the paper. When I went hands on, and ended up using my PR-24, I was in the paper. I just beat the poor 50 year old guy, and he was quoted that "he did everything he was told and obeyed all my commands and I attacked him. The paper was not interested in viewing the video which showed this poor 50 year old logger who was drunk, and was tested for drugs later and had speed in his system. Further this poor old 50 year old man was about 220, and mostly a unstoppable machine of pain and distruction. Further it turns out he was also mental and depressed. I bring this to the table to show that the media, as many know, only show what they want and will get more people the read, knowing most people dislike cops.

Again Glenn, I respect you and I do feel for what you have to deal with. Please understand, when you have even a few minutes to think how to deal with something, it helps, and there are times where you have no info, seconds to act and a lifetime to deal with what happened after.

I know more training would help, and I would agree, but look at what cops have to know;
1. a lawyer so they understand both civil and criminal law.
2. an EMT to save lives
3. a machanic to help people with car problems.
4. a diplomat who always needs to be professional, even when faced with people that make you sick and want to puke.
5. a counciler, to help with family problems.
6. a reporter to report everything you do, and what you see.
7. an athlete who can sit in a car for 5 hours and jump from said car and run for over a mile and then fight some person who has broken the law and would much rather see you dead.
8. a expert marksmen, and if you miss and that round misses and hits someone else, you will be butchered both in the media and in the legal system.
9. a master in physical defence, to not only protect yourself, but the public and your fellow officers.
10. work more hours then should be legal, because you, as an officer, are on duty 24/7, even though you are paid for "on-duty" time.
11. and many other things.

How much training do we need to add to every officer. I understand this issue is important to you Glenn, but how often do officers run into this situation?

I have said for a long time, that if you require a new cop to pass a certain test, then they should be required to pass that test at least every 6 months. Pushups, situps, 1.5 mile run, jump test, etc. That would reduce the fat lazy cops. But I further say, EOE needs to be equal. It doesnt matter your race, or your sex, pass the same test every 6 months, no matter what your rank or position.

Ok I will step down off my soap box.

With respect.


"They should have been on alert that there was a missing autistic teenager in the area," William Karras said.

This one line, shows that the officer did not KNOW he was autistic, if you believe the media. I have never delt with a autistic child, but is it easy to tell a high teen who is on something, or a mental subject? From my training they display simular attitudes. Just a thought

[WhiteHonkyDevil]

I

I know more training would help, and I would agree, but look at what cops have to know;
1. a lawyer so they understand both civil and criminal law.
2. an EMT to save lives
3. a machanic to help people with car problems.
4. a diplomat who always needs to be professional, even when faced with people that make you sick and want to puke.
5. a counciler, to help with family problems.
6. a reporter to report everything you do, and what you see.
7. an athlete who can sit in a car for 5 hours and jump from said car and run for over a mile and then fight some person who has broken the law and would much rather see you dead.
8. a expert marksmen, and if you miss and that round misses and hits someone else, you will be butchered both in the media and in the legal system.
9. a master in physical defence, to not only protect yourself, but the public and your fellow officers.
10. work more hours then should be legal, because you, as an officer, are on duty 24/7, even though you are paid for "on-duty" time.
11. and many other things.



I notice you left off

12. A Franklin Wordmaster, so you can spell and punctuate.

:action-sm

Just fucking with ya. Good post.

[sniper2323]

I notice you left off

12. A Franklin Wordmaster, so you can spell and punctuate.

:action-sm

Just fucking with ya. Good post.

I know, I know, should have taken it into my WP program to have it spell checked. I think we need to setup a donation to get WB to have a spell check...
:action-sm

[HummerTuesdays]

I know, I know, should have taken it into my WP program to have it spell checked. I think we need to setup a donation to get WB to have a spell check...
:action-sm

It's called FireFox. Unfortunately I don't use it at work. :)

[Glenn Dandy]

It's called FireFox. Unfortunately I don't use it at work. :)

true firefox had made my posts almost readable.

Sniper Im with 100% guidlines for being in shape and actualy having a standardized equal testing for intellect as well.

PC has let alot of (not cop material) on police forces.

I agree 100% with your entire post.

A garnered my opinion on a few points. I pride myself for being extremly observant... I grew up in a business family and world watching I call it is the only education allowed in my family.

Points of interest in my thoughts are:

1. age and size 15 years old 5"10 yes but very scrawny if you see the picture of him.

2. timeline...considering he basicly ran because of the glaring sirens and being rapidly approched... out of fear he ran into traffic.. the kid walked 15 miles to the point he was at without incident.

3. according the kids own words...and I dont see him being smart enough to lie or even know why he should lie... thats not autistic behavior.
QUOTE i put my hands behind my head and then was then tazed ( not running in traffic standing in the position)

4. This is how I know its a cowboy cop. yelling at a already tazed individual to place his hands in a place where he could not be grabbing at a weapon? He came up on the kid in the hands behind head position. Face it these cops manhandled this kid for no good reason.

5. I base alot of what I think on what I see... call it silly but the show "COPS" has afforded me to watch thousands of arrests good and bad. These clowns are definatly out there. As stated before Ive had groups of short loser cops try to start shit with me for no reason besides their posturing...

This is my conclusion .... I could be 1000% wrong... but after weighing everythink... this is my hypothesis.


P.S I humble appologize to all the good cops....I know they are out there... I just dont see these guys as them.



HT.....you have to blame the states... the budget is weak as hell. Ive seen it,,, and the cuts statewide.... Im telling you mu sons home manager is managing three homes instead of one. I'll say this... LOOKING FOR A JOB WITH A FUTURE? If you work watchin kids in group homes for the small wage theyoffer... you could get rewarded with money for school to teach,,, It is in my opinion a very good career choice... The patient base is growing faster than theycan create teachers,,, they are pushin motherfuckers through school.

[CaraC]

Cara mentioned earlier that the cop just *had* to know that there was a loose Autistic kid on the streets. Really? Before we had my grandmother in the home she wandered from the house. We weren't really sure how long she was out before my mother was able to inform the police. And since this kid was ABLE TO GET OUT, we have no idea just how long he was out before someone noticed & decided to call the police. Isn't there a chance that the cop got a call about a kid playing in the street, going nuts, before the police got that call that there might be an Autistic kid on the loose?


No I didn't. My specific quote was "Like someone said earlier, they should have been aware that there was a missing teen with autism in the area."
SHOULD have been aware. In general, when there is a missing person, autistic or not, the police are notified in case the person is identified. Just having my own police scanner at home I hear those types of notifications ALL of the time. And seeing as how the boy wandered from a group home, knowing what MY organization's procedures are for a case like this, police WOULD have been notified IMMEDIATELY.

That type of information was NOT given in the article so I was just giving, from what my knowledge of Autism and organizations dealing with Autism typically do, MY opinion of a better alternative than tazing. I, like Glenn Dandy, have a different opinion than a LOT of people who don't know the way the Autistic mind works, and I DO NOT agree that the kid should have been tazed. Especially now, after seeing the boy's quote, because, like Glenn said, the majority of Autistic kids have absolutely no concept of lying and have a weaker filter than our own No Filter Paul.

If anyone thinks he should have been tazed, so be it, but I am entitled to my opinion and had HOPED that my knowledge of Autism may help people to see where people like Glenn, Stalker2, and I are coming from... EVEN if you still want to believe that he should have been tazed, theres no harm in at least considering the other side of an argument... especially in an argument like this where it is obvious that there's NOT going to be a WINNER, but just an "agreement to disagree" ... but if you're arguing my opinion to the point where you've twisted my words, it's clear that this argument could go on forever if some people are unwilling to at least listen to the complexity of the Autistic mind and how those of us who do have some knowledge of it think this could have ended differently.

[Stalker2]

Thank you Cara I really appreciate your wisdom on the subject of autism.
If it weren`t for people like yourself who help people like us [the autistic children and their parents] we would`nt have the help we have today.I really appreciate your help and say thank you from my son and I.

[sniper2323]

true firefox had made my posts almost readable.

Sniper Im with 100% guidlines for being in shape and actualy having a standardized equal testing for intellect as well.

PC has let alot of (not cop material) on police forces.

I agree 100% with your entire post.

A garnered my opinion on a few points. I pride myself for being extremly observant... I grew up in a business family and world watching I call it is the only education allowed in my family.

Points of interest in my thoughts are:

1. age and size 15 years old 5"10 yes but very scrawny if you see the picture of him.

2. timeline...considering he basicly ran because of the glaring sirens and being rapidly approched... out of fear he ran into traffic.. the kid walked 15 miles to the point he was at without incident.

3. according the kids own words...and I dont see him being smart enough to lie or even know why he should lie... thats not autistic behavior.
QUOTE i put my hands behind my head and then was then tazed ( not running in traffic standing in the position)

4. This is how I know its a cowboy cop. yelling at a already tazed individual to place his hands in a place where he could not be grabbing at a weapon? He came up on the kid in the hands behind head position. Face it these cops manhandled this kid for no good reason.

5. I base alot of what I think on what I see... call it silly but the show "COPS" has afforded me to watch thousands of arrests good and bad. These clowns are definatly out there. As stated before Ive had groups of short loser cops try to start shit with me for no reason besides their posturing...

This is my conclusion .... I could be 1000% wrong... but after weighing everythink... this is my hypothesis.


P.S I humble appologize to all the good cops....I know they are out there... I just dont see these guys as them.



HT.....you have to blame the states... the budget is weak as hell. Ive seen it,,, and the cuts statewide.... Im telling you mu sons home manager is managing three homes instead of one. I'll say this... LOOKING FOR A JOB WITH A FUTURE? If you work watchin kids in group homes for the small wage theyoffer... you could get rewarded with money for school to teach,,, It is in my opinion a very good career choice... The patient base is growing faster than theycan create teachers,,, they are pushin motherfuckers through school.

Point 1. I have looked but can not find a pic of the kid. That maybe helpful on this point. Just being skinny, doesn't make them less of a threat, as you know. Again a pic would help.

Point 2. I have a couple questions. He walked 15 miles without a problem? It was only when he hear the sounds of cops. That would make me wonder if he knew he was in trouble. Again, I have had no dealing on a day to day basis with a autistic child. I would guess they have a basic understanding of right from wrong, at least somewhat.

Point 3. I default to you to a degree, again it is the media reporting this, so I do not know. Could he be couched on what to say?

Point 4. again, you have more infor then I do, so I would like to see what you are reading, as I might say wrong call.

Point 5. Ok, Silly, I know most every cop watches "Cops". Most everyone I worked with looks at cops as a "what not to do, training film." I do not claim to be part of the majority, or was a part of the majority, just hope I was, which were the good cops. On a side note, I heard of a short lived TV show that made actors "Sworn officers" and that made me sick when I heard. I never watched one show because I wouldn't deal with it well.

Like you, I am tired of seeing law enforcement be turmed into a $$$ agency. But times they have changed, and it is not for the better in my eyes.

[CaraC]

Thank you Cara I really appreciate your wisdom on the subject of autism.
If it weren`t for people like yourself who help people like us [the autistic children and their parents] we would`nt have the help we have today.I really appreciate your help and say thank you from my son and I.

:) Of course... I absolutely love what I do, love my students and just think about what I would do if this situation happened to one of my kids... I would certainly be doing more than posting on the internet about it! It's people like you and your son who make me want to get up for work everyday (even if I do hit snooze 100 times ;))

[Glenn Dandy]

K

[CaraC]

Point 3. I default to you to a degree, again it is the media reporting this, so I do not know. Could he be couched on what to say?

I'll sort of help to answer Glenn on this one even though I'm sure he will give his own answer as well...
One thing this story doesn't say is the level of functioning this kid has... they've only slapped the label of "autistic" on it, and it doesn't specify where in the HUGE spectrum of autism he is at... but I will say, however, the majority of autistic kids could not have been coached that QUICKLY to respond to the reporter like that. Kids with autism, in many cases, are coached to even say their feelings, their illnesses, simple hellos/goodbyes, and it takes months, years or never... but if this kid is at a moderate functioning level (which he seems to be seeing as how he is verbal but still wandered out of the home without knowledge of the dangers involved) then it would have taken a while for his parents or anyone else to coach him on what to say... kids with autism who are verbal tend to shoot from the hip with what they say... Like I said, we don't know where he is at functionally, but I tend to doubt he could have been coached to say that, especially so soon.

[Glenn Dandy]

Point 1. I have looked but can not find a pic of the kid. That maybe helpful on this point. Just being skinny, doesn't make them less of a threat, as you know. Again a pic would help.

Point 2. I have a couple questions. He walked 15 miles without a problem? It was only when he hear the sounds of cops. That would make me wonder if he knew he was in trouble. Again, I have had no dealing on a day to day basis with a autistic child. I would guess they have a basic understanding of right from wrong, at least somewhat.

Point 3. I default to you to a degree, again it is the media reporting this, so I do not know. Could he be couched on what to say?

Point 4. again, you have more infor then I do, so I would like to see what you are reading, as I might say wrong call.

K

Point 5. Ok, Silly, I know most every cop watches "Cops". Most everyone I worked with looks at cops as a "what not to do, training film." I do not claim to be part of the majority, or was a part of the majority, just hope I was, which were the good cops. On a side note, I heard of a short lived TV show that made actors "Sworn officers" and that made me sick when I heard. I never watched one show because I wouldn't deal with it well.

Like you, I am tired of seeing law enforcement be turmed into a $$$ agency. But times they have changed, and it is not for the better in my eyes.


ok .....

[Glenn Dandy]

I'll sort of help to answer Glenn on this one even though I'm sure he will give his own answer as well...
One thing this story doesn't say is the level of functioning this kid has... they've only slapped the label of "autistic" on it, and it doesn't specify where in the HUGE spectrum of autism he is at... but I will say, however, the majority of autistic kids could not have been coached that QUICKLY to respond to the reporter like that. Kids with autism, in many cases, are coached to even say their feelings, their illnesses, simple hellos/goodbyes, and it takes months, years or never... but if this kid is at a moderate functioning level (which he seems to be seeing as how he is verbal but still wandered out of the home without knowledge of the dangers involved) then it would have taken a while for his parents or anyone else to coach him on what to say... kids with autism who are verbal tend to shoot from the hip with what they say... Like I said, we don't know where he is at functionally, but I tend to doubt he could have been coached to say that, especially so soon.


Can cops be this smart... I should hope its part of their training.


It's not rocket science...

It is however 1 in 94 boys born in New jersey.

Probably a bigger demographic than drugs.


And ruining alot more lives.

Of good people.



GLENN DANDY CASE O BEER.

[sniper2323]

No I didn't. My specific quote was "Like someone said earlier, they should have been aware that there was a missing teen with autism in the area."
SHOULD have been aware. In general, when there is a missing person, autistic or not, the police are notified in case the person is identified. Just having my own police scanner at home I hear those types of notifications ALL of the time. And seeing as how the boy wandered from a group home, knowing what MY organization's procedures are for a case like this, police WOULD have been notified IMMEDIATELY.

That type of information was NOT given in the article so I was just giving, from what my knowledge of Autism and organizations dealing with Autism typically do, MY opinion of a better alternative than tazing. I, like Glenn Dandy, have a different opinion than a LOT of people who don't know the way the Autistic mind works, and I DO NOT agree that the kid should have been tazed. Especially now, after seeing the boy's quote, because, like Glenn said, the majority of Autistic kids have absolutely no concept of lying and have a weaker filter than our own No Filter Paul.

If anyone thinks he should have been tazed, so be it, but I am entitled to my opinion and had HOPED that my knowledge of Autism may help people to see where people like Glenn, Stalker2, and I are coming from... EVEN if you still want to believe that he should have been tazed, theres no harm in at least considering the other side of an argument... especially in an argument like this where it is obvious that there's NOT going to be a WINNER, but just an "agreement to disagree" ... but if you're arguing my opinion to the point where you've twisted my words, it's clear that this argument could go on forever if some people are unwilling to at least listen to the complexity of the Autistic mind and how those of us who do have some knowledge of it think this could have ended differently.

Glenn said that the child was found 15 miles away from the point where he ran from. The total land mass of Tustin. in wiki is 11.4 miles of land. so he crossed lines. Maybe locals were notified, but not knowing the time frame, I know if I was at the line, I would not see a M.S. (Mental subject) going 15 miles without someone (Police, Fire, Medic) spotting him, even in just a possible spotting him.

Again, there is a lack of training in law enforcement in ref M.S. basicly, they are not rational, have drug indused (sp) like power and pain resistance. I also read somewhere in the tread that this 15 yearold had a beard. So it is hard to tell.

If the officers did not know a discription of the kid, no sightings to let units know he was headed thier way, etc. It could be a mistake. I mean we are talking about California.:action-sm

[sniper2323]

Can cops be this smart... I should hope its part of their training.


It's not rocket science...

It is however 1 in 94 boys born in New jersey.

Probably a bigger demographic than drugs.


And ruining alot more lives.

Of good people.



GLENN DANDY CASE O BEER.

I could do a WB comment, but I won't. Because I would like to know.

I am not on the force anymore because I got tired of the politics. But I am one of the first they call to help find people in the mountains.

All I can say, it is really hard to find good people, who will do the job, put up with the crap of the job, and try to do things they are not trained for when you don't have time to call in someone who is trained. Hell I had to try to stick pics with people who did not speak english to understand what the problem was.

As much as I wish, Cops do not have PhD's in every subject. and alot do not recieve training in the basics.

So I submit this. Have the state give them a basic understanding of mental subjects. I had to take a class on my own $, and I still feel I have not enough knowledge to deal with these people.

[weakside]

I think some people on this board find this topic too personal to objectively judge the actions of the officer. In addition, none of us were there and can't say with any certainty beyond blind opinion whether it was the right decision or not.

But I will offer this quote from the article that really sums it up, "The teen was home with his parents Tuesday, uninjured.."

There are at least a dozen ways this could have ended badly but it didn't. The boy was unharmed, the motorists were unharmed, and the cops were unharmed. Those facts alone suggests that perhaps no matter how personal we try to make this story, the right decision might have been made after all.

[HummerTuesdays]

Cara, the only issue I have is that you say the police were notified "immediately." Unfortunately, that means "as soon as they realized he was missing." The kid got FIFTEEN miles from the home. How long was he gone before the cops were notified? He could have been gone well over an hour before anyone noticed, and it's difficult for police to figure out how wide of an area to search when they don't know how long someone has been gone. Especially a very mobile teenager. (My grandmother was old & frail, and didn't get too far.)

And so the home calls the police in one town, but how many surrounding towns are the notifying? And I'll give this kid credit. 15 miles is one hell of a trek. Did they let the police know that he's a distance runner/walker? We'll never know.

[CaraC]

Cara, the only issue I have is that you say the police were notified "immediately." Unfortunately, that means "as soon as they realized he was missing." The kid got FIFTEEN miles from the home. How long was he gone before the cops were notified? He could have been gone well over an hour before anyone noticed, and it's difficult for police to figure out how wide of an area to search when they don't know how long someone has been gone. Especially a very mobile teenager. (My grandmother was old & frail, and didn't get too far.)

And so the home calls the police in one town, but how many surrounding towns are the notifying? And I'll give this kid credit. 15 miles is one hell of a trek. Did they let the police know that he's a distance runner/walker? We'll never know.

Again, you've twisted my words. I DID NOT say that "the cops were notified immediately," I said, EXACTLY: "knowing what MY organization's procedures are for a case like this, police WOULD have been notified IMMEDIATELY" ...
I'm giving the example of MY ORGANIZATION... NOT this one... and we don't know all of the answers to all of the questions we have... but my opinion will not change, no matter how much you keep twisting my words.

[HummerTuesdays]

Either way, your organization would notify the police immediately UPON REALIZING SOMEONE WAS GONE. Sorry for the caps, but I want to emphasize that. If you do a head count and some one is gone, you can only guess that they left at some point since the last head count. It could be five minutes, it could be 2 hours since someone served him/her lunch.

My point, which I think is getting lost, is that the term "immediately" means "when we realize it" not "immediately after he walked out the door."

[CaraC]

Either way, your organization would notify the police immediately UPON REALIZING SOMEONE WAS GONE. Sorry for the caps, but I want to emphasize that. If you do a head count and some one is gone, you can only guess that they left at some point since the last head count. It could be five minutes, it could be 2 hours since someone served him/her lunch.

My point, which I think is getting lost, is that the term "immediately" means "when we realize it" not "immediately after he walked out the door."

The reason why I, personally, took your point differently is because we WOULD notice immediately. We don't do "head counts," we are "on ratio" with 1 or 2 students at a time to do work with them at the school or to do living skills with them at the residences. We are with those 1 or 2 for the entire block of time that we are assigned to them. Also, all of the doors have alarms on them, and when the alarms go off, we check the doors to make sure of who is coming in or out. So judging by what I know, with my organization, we would know immediately... which is probably why we've never had a kid run far enough to notify the police... not even out of the driveway for that matter. I don't know anything about the type of organization this kid was at but even if it is less organized, like some of my past jobs, no place could go 2 hours without noticing a child was missing.

[Glenn Dandy]

This kids high fuctioning... I think that really needs to be recognized here.

Most kids are watched like hawks... It the only reason my sons in a home... I sleep... therefor he is in danger of getting out... where he lives there is always staff 24/7 on duty... to watch they don't decide to take a midnight stroll.

that was the clincher for us.. my son got up earlier than everyone and went outside... luckily a neighbor knew his deal and brought him home... but the scare was enough to realize we needed help in procuring his safety.

recently they are throwing around ideas to place GPS chips in the kids... Ive heard some shit bout cancer but a fucking truck running him over sounds worse to me... I'll take the chip.

My son couldnt walk 15 miles he would be hit by a car in minutes. no clue, he is in his own lil world.

[Stalker2]

My kid escaped a couple times.He ran up the road to the corner gas station and went on a snack binge before they stopped him.Thanks again to Cara...I appreciate the help you give to parents of autistic children as myself.Thank you Cara you probably don`t know how much people like myself appreciate your help!

[Glenn Dandy]

Autism is crazy.. when my son was lil mayby 3 or 4 years old.i remember doing an experiment with him at the beach.

I just let him go... he walked 500 yards down that beach not once looking back to his parents.I think normal is 10 - 15 feet before a child looks to make sure his parents are still close by.

[BIV]

I'm not going to make any friends with this, but I don't care.

I don't care if it's an autistic kid or a rocket scientist.
I don't care if it's 15-year-old scrawny kid or a 250 pound body builder.
I don't care if you are causing a danger to the public from running in traffic or brandishing a weapon.

If I'm a cop (which I'm not) and I arrive at the scene, and you are a danger to the public, you have one chance to do what I say. If not, zappo. Continue to resist? Zappo. Figure out the details later.

I don't know where this pansy ass, panty wetting attitude comes from. No one was hurt. That's the whole point of the fucking tazer, no one gets hurt. Not just the suspect but the cops as well.

Cops' priorities are a three step order:
1. Protect the public and the public property
2. Protect themselves and fellow officers
3. Protect the suspect.

Going into traffic to physically subdue a suspect threatens #1 and #2. Part of the point of the tazer was to keep cops out of physical confrontations.

Cops come up to this scene. They see a teen in traffic, acting strange and irrational. He is a danger to himself and, more importantly, to motorists. Police don't know why he is acting strange. He was Autistic, but he could have been having a psychotic break, he could have been high on crack or PCP (or whatever kids use these days). The cop doesn't know and he is trained to assume the worst, again to protect lives. In this situation, a cop would be out of his God damn mind to get within grappling distance of the kid when he can use a taser and no one will get hurt.

[Glenn Dandy]

noone gets hurt huh.... can I shoot you will 50,000 volts of electricy twice for no reason and ask you that question again?


guessin it kinda sucks getting tazed... and if you read the thread you would see the kid got tazed after he put his hands on his head after the officers command to do so.

[BIV]

noone gets hurt huh.... can I shoot you will 50,000 volts of electricy twice for no reason and ask you that question again?
Fine, damaged. Is that better Mr. Semantics?


guessin it kinda sucks getting tazed... and if you read the thread you would see the kid got tazed after he put his hands on his head after the officers command to do so.
Sorry, I know your situation, but I'm going to believe the cop before I trust the perceptions of a kid that didn't have enough sense to stay out of the street.

[Glenn Dandy]

Cage goes in the water. Ralphie May's in the water. Our Ralphie.

cracks me up every time i read it...

thats fine:) thats your opinion.

[BIV]

cracks me up every time i read it...

thats fine:) thats your opinion.

Ah you. *tussle*