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2017 NFL Season thread...

Discussion in 'Sports' started by TreeFortRichard, Sep 7, 2017.

  1. Jacuzzi Billy

    Jacuzzi Billy Watching PTI
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    I don't like drafting by position either. But certain positions are much more important than others. Running back is important enough but there's no value there because the fourth string running backs on every team are probably just as good as the first string. I'm not joking or exaggerating when I say that.
     
  2. Pigdango

    Pigdango Silence, you mortal Fuck!
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    You may not be joking or exaggerating, but you're also not right.

    2017's RB class so far has been far superior to the QB class. The misconception that RB's get hurt and QB's are a better investment was proven wrong when Deshaun Watson blew out his ACL. We'll get to a few more of those in a second...

    2016 had Goff and Wentz, but Ezekial Elliott as well.

    2015 - Gurley and Gordon have been way the fuck better than Mariotta and Winston

    2014 - The NFL collectively followed your line of thinking and passed over RB in the first round, and was rewarded with Blake Bortles, Johnny Manziel, and Teddy Bridgewater. Meanwhile, 2nd rounders Carlos Hyde and Jeremy Hill are having solid careers. The second round also featured Bishop Sankey and David Carr, but still...

    2013 - No RB's again. The Bills got their QB of the future in EJ Manuel though. So you know...right. That's ok, it's not like Le'Veon Bell was sitting there. Oh. Oh....

    2012 - Two QB's (Luck and Griffin) and a RB (Richardson) taken with the first three picks, and all of their careers are over. There were tons of both taken in the round. QB's Tannehill (Not bad, but out for the season) Weeden (So why do the Browns need a QB this year?) RB's Doug Martin, who is very good, and David Wilson, who like Weeden and the top 3 picks is out of football.

    I think that's far enough. Objectively I'd have to give the edge to the RB's overall. Drafting a QB in the first round seems like a generally bad idea.
     
  3. Jacuzzi Billy

    Jacuzzi Billy Watching PTI
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    I have no idea what any of this has to do with 4th string running backs being as good as1st string. It's something I have been tracking for a long time. A few irrelevant stats from the past few years comparing QBs to RBs isnt going to change my mind.
     
  4. Jacuzzi Billy

    Jacuzzi Billy Watching PTI
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    Btw, I am 100% sure there 50 running backs on the street right now who are better than Melvin Gordon. He's terrible, don't care about his stats.
     
  5. Pigdango

    Pigdango Silence, you mortal Fuck!
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    That was such a ridiculous point I couldn't even begin to process it, but fuck it, let's dig in. If you've been tracking it, you've probably got lots of examples.

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Pigdango

    Pigdango Silence, you mortal Fuck!
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    :haha7::haha7::haha7::haha7::haha7::haha7:

    I was right. This is gonna be good.
     
  7. Jacuzzi Billy

    Jacuzzi Billy Watching PTI
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    I've got plenty of examples. Why would you think I didn't? You know I wouldn't claim it unless I did. I'll give them after work.

    The fact you think Melvin Gordon is good just goes to show you have absolutely no clue what you are talking about.
     
  8. Pigdango

    Pigdango Silence, you mortal Fuck!
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    I look forward to your in depth analysis that proves...Branden Oliver(?) is better than him. Oh wait, he's third string. Derek Watt. He's the one we have to look at. He has no stats, but stats don't matter. I'll wait for the tape.
     
  9. Jacuzzi Billy

    Jacuzzi Billy Watching PTI
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    Derek Watt will not be used. For Melvin, you simply have to use the eye test to know he sucks. It's pretty obvious and I have no clue why you'd fight me on this.
     
  10. Pigdango

    Pigdango Silence, you mortal Fuck!
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    I'm pretty annoyed that you're making me defend a Charger. I hate the fucking Chargers. I've watched some youtube videos and he looks pretty good to my eye. Granted, they are highlight videos, but it seems to me like he works pretty well with his line, can make guys miss, has a good stiffarm that he maybe could use more often, moves the pile very well for the extra yard(s), and has a great burst when he gets to the open field.

    I've no idea how he is as a blocker, but Phillip Rivers has only been sacked 11 times this year, so I assume he's got at least some small hand in that. Even if his blocking sucks, his pass catching ability is clearly a useful tool to get Rivers out of trouble.

    I'll throw a couple stats out there because I think they're important - After some problems in his rookie year, he's only fumbled twice in the last 477 times he's handled the ball. That's impressive. Another impressive stat - he rushed for 61 First Downs last year - 8th in the league on a pass first team. 6th in the league for backs that had 200+ attempts. And over half of his receptions were for first downs, which ranked 7th in the league.

    Fucking Christ, JB. Can you at least tell me you think Phillip Rivers is a Hall of Famer so I can spend some time tearing that case apart?
     
  11. Stormrider666

    Stormrider666 Hell is home.

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    I want to amend your rule when it comes to drafting that early- you take the best player on the board that fulfills your team's main need. If that happens to be your QB, so be it. But if that QB becomes unavailable, then you move to the best player that fulfills your secondary need. Or you move back a few spots to a position where you feel comfortable drafting a player or move out of the first round altogether collecting more picks as you do. The same goes if you're not too enthusiastic about any of the top 5 picks.

    What you don't do is draft QB just to say you drafted one. That's exactly what all those teams did in the 2014 draft.
     
  12. Jacuzzi Billy

    Jacuzzi Billy Watching PTI
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    @Pigdango I'll start with a scenario in which you are probably very familiar...Terrell Davis and the backs that followed. After his 2000 yard season, the following season Gary rushed for 1160 in 12 games. The year after that, Mike Anderson, who started the season 4th string I believe, rushed for 1500 yards in basically 12 games. Davis was a good back but he wasn't anything special. That line was special...one of the best ever. Any back would have put up the numbers TD did, even a 4th stringer, and one did.

    A few recent examples from this year...

    Alex Collins started the season as the 4th string back for the Ravens. I guarantee if he was starting in Dallas, he would be leading the league in rushing yards. There's no difference between him and the best backs in the league.

    Fournette was drafted 4th overall this year. I don't know why but I have seen a few Jaguar games. Fournette isn't any better than their other backs. Ivory is just as good. Yeldon might be better. And even their 4th string guy, Corey Grant, could do what Fournette has done given the chance.


    I can give plenty more examples if you want. Let's start with these and see what you think.
     
  13. Pigdango

    Pigdango Silence, you mortal Fuck!
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    Except those Broncos didn’t put up the numbers TD did. TD averaged 117 and 125 yards per game in 97 and 98. Gary averaged 96. Anderson 93. Gary also scored only 7 Touchdowns vs TD’s 15 and 21. So using your own example, those guys were at best 75-80% of the player TD was.

    Football is a team sport, so of course the Broncos’ line made TD look better, but he made them look better, too. Tom Brady wouldn’t be as good as he is on any other team, but that doesn’t mean he’s not good. To say TD was “nothing special” is...well, it doesn’t exactly do much for your case.

    Alex Collins has started what, 5 games and we’re ready to put him in the Pro Bowl? Ok...

    Chris Ivory has had a lot of chances to do what Fournette has done, and he’s never come close. TJ Yeldon had the chance last year, and they drafted Fournette, which says all that needs to be said there. I don’t know Grant, but considering you’re wrong on the first two, I think it’s safe to assume that’s not right either.

    Maybe you don’t feel a 20-25% difference in productivity is relevant, but I do. Getting 1 less yard per carry, 25 fewer yards per game is very relevant. It changes everything about the offensive game plan.
     
  14. Pigdango

    Pigdango Silence, you mortal Fuck!
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    I’ll meet you halfway. If the Eagles are drafting and the best player on the board is a QB, they should draft someone else.
     
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  15. Stormrider666

    Stormrider666 Hell is home.

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    Exactly they don't need to draft a QB. So they draft the the next best player that they need.

    Also that "your" is confusing. It doesn't mean the guy you already have, it means the guy you think is going to be your franchise QB for next 10-12 years.
     
  16. Ballbuster1

    Ballbuster1 Wubba Lubba Dub Dub
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    The NFLPA and Elliot have ended their attempts to appeal.

    Zeke does the full 6 weeks right now.
     
  17. mr. sin

    mr. sin Registered User

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  18. goat999

    goat999 town drunk

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    Beautiful drive by the Saints with a minute left.
     
  19. Ballbuster1

    Ballbuster1 Wubba Lubba Dub Dub
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    That was an epic 4th quarter collapse by the Skins.
     
  20. Ballbuster1

    Ballbuster1 Wubba Lubba Dub Dub
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    Ad KC gets beat by the Giants in OT.
    We saw some of that great clock management by Reid again in the 4th.
     
  21. mikeybot

    mikeybot SPANAKOPITA!!!

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    Well, it's not like he's had a lot of experience playing against Eli...oh...
     
  22. Jacuzzi Billy

    Jacuzzi Billy Watching PTI
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    Peterman...:haha7::haha7::haha7:
     
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  23. Chip Spackler

    Chip Spackler Patron Saint of Autists
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  24. Chip Spackler

    Chip Spackler Patron Saint of Autists
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  25. goat999

    goat999 town drunk

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    Terry Glenn, dead as fuck at 43.
     

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