Damn you Obama and your wide open border policy!

MayrMeninoCrash

Liberal Psycopath
Dec 9, 2004
24,337
8,515
693
Silverdale, WA
#1
.......no one is around to pick our vegetables!

California Farm Labor Shortage 'Worst It's Been, Ever'

There's a different sort of drought plaguing California, the nation's largest farm state. It's $38 billion agricultural sector is facing a scarcity of labor.

"This year is the worst it's been, ever," said Craig Underwood, who farms everything from strawberries to lemons to peppers, carrots, and turnips in Ventura County.

Some crops aren't get picked this season due to a lack of workers.

"We just left them in the field," he said.

The Western Growers Association told CNBC its members are reporting a 20 percent drop in laborers this year. Stronger border controls are keeping workers from crossing into the U.S. illegally, and the current guest worker program is not providing enough bodies. (Related: Massive US Drought Leads to Worst Fears for Corn Crop.)

"We have 100 fewer people this year," said Sergio Diaz, who provides workers under contract for growers. "We're having difficulty finding people to do this work."

The lack of workers is forcing farmers to pay more. In one of Underwood's fields, pickers are harvesting peppers for $9.25 a hour, or $5 a bucket, whichever is more. Craig Underwood said his workforce is aging and starting to retire, and no one is coming in to replace them.

"Migratory flows between Mexico and the United States have come to a halt," Carlos Gonzalez Gutierrez, consul general of Mexico in Sacramento, told a California farm bureau labor committee, according to AgAlert.

Growers of California's wine grapes are concerned there won't be enough pickers for this fall's harvest. Berry growers — among the highest paying — saw fewer field hands show up in the spring.

"Fruit that you should be picking is not being picked," said grower John Eiskamp.

Most pickers in California are not here legally, a fact of life for decades.

When asked if any local residents have come out to apply to work in the fields, Craig Underwood replied, "None. Absolutely none." He is even having trouble finding truck drivers and other semi-skilled labor for jobs that pay $12-$18 an hour. (Related: America's Top States for Job Creation.)

The industry lost many workers to home construction during the housing boom, but those workers have not returned.

"The downturn should be helping us," Underwood said.

He wishes the labor dilemma, which extends beyond California, would get the attention of the presidential campaign, but it hasn't. (Related: Election 2012: Your Money, Your Vote.)

While standing in a field of peppers, Underwood realizes even if he doesn't have enough labor to pick his crop, Americans will still have food.

"It'll just be grown in Mexico," he said. "Or China."
http://www.cnbc.com/id/48725145
 

Ballbuster1

In The Danger Zone...
Wackbag Staff
Aug 26, 2002
102,853
16,623
839
Your house, behind the couch
#3
Blame the shit heads that demanded illegals get treated better.
Nobody really cared when they just worked and stayed quiet.

The problem started when they wanted to be treated as citizens
even though they got here illegally. Can't have it both ways.
 

lajikal

Registered User
Aug 6, 2009
15,741
3,826
328
#4
Oh yeah, it's election year again. Time to talk about spics again. Let's just make excuses about alabama or just not talk about it. Hmm, what else.
 

whiskeyguy

PR representative for Drunk Whiskeyguy.
Donator
Jan 12, 2010
36,352
21,978
398
Northern California
#5
Meanwhile unemployment is around 16%. I'm sure the lack of US citizens available to pick fruit has nothing to do with the 99 weeks of unemployment compensation they're "entitled" to.
 

BIV

I'm Biv Dick Black, the Over Poster.
Apr 22, 2002
78,491
27,315
898
Seattle
#6
Meanwhile unemployment is around 16%. I'm sure the lack of US citizens available to pick fruit has nothing to do with the 99 weeks of unemployment compensation they're "entitled" to.
Exactly. Stop giving out the hand outs and you'll find people knocking on your doors.

Oh, and how about you pay more than minimum wage, you asshat farmers. It's hard labor, not some asshole on a line in a auto plant. Pay them.
 

MayrMeninoCrash

Liberal Psycopath
Dec 9, 2004
24,337
8,515
693
Silverdale, WA
#7
Let's play "How do I know you didn't read the article"

Oh yeah, it's election year again. Time to talk about spics again. Let's just make excuses about alabama or just not talk about it. Hmm, what else.
This article is discussing California, not Alabama

Exactly. Stop giving out the hand outs and you'll find people knocking on your doors.

Oh, and how about you pay more than minimum wage, you asshat farmers. It's hard labor, not some asshole on a line in a auto plant. Pay them.
When asked if any local residents have come out to apply to work in the fields, Craig Underwood replied, "None. Absolutely none." He is even having trouble finding truck drivers and other semi-skilled labor for jobs that pay $12-$18 an hour.
$12-18/hr seems quite a bit more than minimum wage. Farmers are having problems filling jobs at all pay levels.
 

Jon the Cop

Registered User
Oct 20, 2008
1,040
0
111
Indiana
#8
I wonder if they are having trouble finding pickers because these newer immigrants/illegals are going into more restaurant/factory/construction jobs elsewhere?

I know there's been some anger around the Midwest at factories over them bringing in lots of illegals through temp agencies rather than hiring guys in on regular pay/benefits. Of course the unions are upset because they're not getting all those dues. Then the labor unions are regularly protesting construction sites because companies are employing Mexicans etc.
 

lajikal

Registered User
Aug 6, 2009
15,741
3,826
328
#10
Let's play "How do I know you didn't read the article"



This article is discussing California, not Alabama
That's my point. Where's the anti-spics crying 'i told you so' over alabama now? I love hearing the excuses.
 

Norm Stansfield

私は亀が好きだ。
Mar 17, 2009
15,949
4,075
328
#11
Blame the shit heads that demanded illegals get treated better.
Nobody really cared when they just worked and stayed quiet.

The problem started when they wanted to be treated as citizens
even though they got here illegally. Can't have it both ways.
No, I'm pretty sure I'm gonna blame the thugs who took it upon themselves to decide who deserves to enter the US and who doesn't.

This is just another example of what happens when a part of the free market is taken over by central planners.
 
Feb 5, 2003
5,546
919
753
With a stranger
#12
1. I find it difficult to believe that there is a sudden shortage of illegal immigrants--especially in California

2. If these farmers really want local citizens to work there, they should advertise that they are hiring. Note that the writer of the article didn't ask the farmer if he had advertised that he's hiring (or didn't include it in the article because the farmer didn't advertise that and it doesn't fit the "American citizens refuse to do those jobs, so we need illegal immigrants" agenda--which, if true, would also be an argument against the current welfare system since you can't argue that unemployed people who refuse to find work deserve assistance).

3. This article seems like it's trying to portray the unemployment situation in our country as better than it really is. If this farmer can't find any unemployed U.S. citizens to take a job driving a truck for $18/hour then it must mean that there's a labor shortage. I guess the economy will be all better by the end of the week, then. That's fantastic news! If you don't think that illegal immigrants taking those types of jobs is a problem, consider this: California is in horrible shape financially. That state is bankrupt and many cities in it are bankrupt. Illegal immigrants don't pay income tax, which is how the state makes money. $18/hour works out to be over $37k per year. Even if that person receives a tax refund at the end of the year it won't be a 100% refund, so the state will make money from that person (and also have the added benefit of not having to pay out whatever welfare benefits that person was collecting, if any). So how much money would the state stand to make and save if our immigration laws were enforced more strictly? For a state in such bad financial shape, it would help a lot.
 

Begbie

Wackbag Generalissimo
Jul 21, 2003
17,843
5,188
838
Wilmington, NC
#13
.......no one is around to pick our vegetables!
I got you guys covered...I see about a dozen more of them waiting out front of my local Home Depot whenever I drive past it in the morning. I'd be glad to send them your way.
 

Norm Stansfield

私は亀が好きだ。
Mar 17, 2009
15,949
4,075
328
#14
So how much money would the state stand to make and save if our immigration laws were enforced more strictly?
The verb you should use is not make or save, it's take. Take from farmers, to be specific. And it wouldn't just be the state who took, it would also be the feds (who take almost the amount an employee makes, in payroll taxes).

So the answer depends on whether the federal government would step in and subsidize the failing farmers. If it didn't, then none, because the farmers who rely on illegal immigration would just go bankrupt, and their business would move to Mexico, where the cheap labor is.

See, what you, from your arm-chair perspective on how to properly run a farm in California don't realize is that farming is a manual labor intensive industry, and that native labor would be about 5 times more expensive than Mexican labor (not because the native workers would be getting paid 5 times more, but because the three layers of government would be getting paid more than the workers). That wouldn't work. A business only works if it has more revenue than expenditure.

It's funny how you go over every detail of how to run a business, in your post, but you never even mention the words revenue, expenditure, or profit. That's the typical attitude of thugs who use politics for their thuggery: you think it's your job to tell business owners how to run their business, but it's their concern whether it's profitable or not.
 
Feb 5, 2003
5,546
919
753
With a stranger
#15
The verb you should use is not make or save, it's take. Take from farmers, to be specific. And it wouldn't just be the state who took, it would also be the feds (who take almost the amount an employee makes, in payroll taxes).

So the answer depends on whether the federal government would step in and subsidize the failing farmers. If it didn't, then none, because the farmers who rely on illegal immigration would just go bankrupt, and their business would move to Mexico, where the cheap labor is.

See, what you, from your arm-chair perspective on how to properly run a farm in California don't realize is that farming is a manual labor intensive industry, and that native labor would be about 5 times more expensive than Mexican labor (not because the native workers would be getting paid 5 times more, but because the three layers of government would be getting paid more than the workers). That wouldn't work. A business only works if it has more revenue than expenditure.

It's funny how you go over every detail of how to run a business, in your post, but you never even mention the words revenue, expenditure, or profit. That's the typical attitude of thugs who use politics for their thuggery: you think it's your job to tell business owners how to run their business, but it's their concern whether it's profitable or not.
Wow. Where should I start?

I guess I'll start with the fact that you think I'm too stupid to know that framing is manual labor. It's a good thing you pointed that out. I always thought that people were referring to a Mexican named Manuel La Bor. Now I know, so thank you.

Next, I'm not a thug. If you have a problem with paying taxes, why don't you run for office and come up with a way to run things for free? I'm sure you'll find a way to maintain highways, pay our soldiers, run the FBI, control air traffic across the country, etc. without collecting any money. How much money do you think that farmer wasted by not having those crops picked? I would think that not selling something you already paid to grow is worse than selling it and not making as much of a profit on it as you want. When I was getting my BA in Business I seem to remember someone once telling me that a small profit is better than no profit, but maybe I just went to a crappy school or didn't pay attention. But thank you for explaining how businesses make a profit. If I'd known you 10 years ago I could have saved a small fortune and might not have become such a thug.
 

lajikal

Registered User
Aug 6, 2009
15,741
3,826
328
#16
I used to be the dean at the harvard community college of business. Big whoop.
 

MayrMeninoCrash

Liberal Psycopath
Dec 9, 2004
24,337
8,515
693
Silverdale, WA
#17
That's my point. Where's the anti-spics crying 'i told you so' over alabama now? I love hearing the excuses.
This has nothing to do with Alabama. The labor shortage there was artificial, caused by new laws holding farmers accountable for the eligibility of their employees. Here it's pure free market, the farmers aren't asking any questions and still can't gather enough warm bodies from the migrant populations to get their work done.
 
Dec 8, 2004
48,661
20,955
693
Maine
#18
Wow. Where should I start?

I guess I'll start with the fact that you think I'm too stupid to know that framing is manual labor. It's a good thing you pointed that out. I always thought that people were referring to a Mexican named Manuel La Bor. Now I know, so thank you.

Next, I'm not a thug. If you have a problem with paying taxes, why don't you run for office and come up with a way to run things for free? I'm sure you'll find a way to maintain highways, pay our soldiers, run the FBI, control air traffic across the country, etc. without collecting any money. How much money do you think that farmer wasted by not having those crops picked? I would think that not selling something you already paid to grow is worse than selling it and not making as much of a profit on it as you want. When I was getting my BA in Business I seem to remember someone once telling me that a small profit is better than no profit, but maybe I just went to a crappy school or didn't pay attention. But thank you for explaining how businesses make a profit. If I'd known you 10 years ago I could have saved a small fortune and might not have become such a thug.
Well North Korea abolished taxes... (from Wiki) North Korea claims that it is the only state in the world that does not levy taxes. Taxes were abolished beginning on April 1, 1974.

That seems to be working out well...

Or could do:

[h=3]Bonds[/h] Since 2003 North Korean authorities issue government bonds called The "People's Life Bonds". It offers no interest over the 10-year lifespan, but, in the event purchasers win in a related lottery, the winner will be entitled to interest when the bonds are redeemed. Buyers of more than 1 million won worth of bonds will also be awarded with a decoration for their expression of affection for the home country by the North Korean government. Moreover, there is evidence that purchase of the bonds was not altogether voluntary, as committees were established in every province, city, county, institute, factory, village, and town to promote their sale as a “patriotic deed"[SUP][citation needed][/SUP].
North Korea sold bonds internationally in the late 1970s for 680 million Deutsche marks and 455 million Swiss francs. North Korea defaulted on these bonds by 1984, although the bonds remain traded internationally on speculation that the country will eventually perform on the obligations.[SUP][13]
[/SUP]
 

lajikal

Registered User
Aug 6, 2009
15,741
3,826
328
#19
This has nothing to do with Alabama. The labor shortage there was artificial, caused by new laws holding farmers accountable for the eligibility of their employees. Here it's pure free market, the farmers aren't asking any questions and still can't gather enough warm bodies from the migrant populations to get their work done.
My argument was directed at the spic haters, not your dumb ass.
 

LineBackerU

There is a good chance I am blocking you.
Donator
Oct 14, 2002
1,744
964
778
#20
Simple answer that will appease liberals and conservatives. For the liberals, since it is racist, homophobic, xenophobic, and imperialistic for the United States of America to enforce its federal immigration laws (remember it is perfectly PC for OTHER countries to decided who should and shouldn't be allowed to enter their countries), open boarders so all the "brown" people that want to enter the country can come in. For the conservatives, make an illegal alien earning cap. Illegal aliens can only make a maximum of 30 cents per hour and must work a minimum of 95 hours per week.
 

Norm Stansfield

私は亀が好きだ。
Mar 17, 2009
15,949
4,075
328
#21
Wow. Where should I start?

I guess I'll start with the fact that you think I'm too stupid to know that framing is manual labor. It's a good thing you pointed that out. I always thought that people were referring to a Mexican named Manuel La Bor. Now I know, so thank you.

Next, I'm not a thug. If you have a problem with paying taxes, why don't you run for office and come up with a way to run things for free? I'm sure you'll find a way to maintain highways, pay our soldiers, run the FBI, control air traffic across the country, etc. without collecting any money. How much money do you think that farmer wasted by not having those crops picked? I would think that not selling something you already paid to grow is worse than selling it and not making as much of a profit on it as you want. When I was getting my BA in Business I seem to remember someone once telling me that a small profit is better than no profit, but maybe I just went to a crappy school or didn't pay attention. But thank you for explaining how businesses make a profit. If I'd known you 10 years ago I could have saved a small fortune and might not have become such a thug.
I love that you got offended because I dismissed your questioning of actual, informed business owners' decisions. I apologize, you're right. You know better than they do, and no one should challenge you on that, because you have a BA in Business and they don't.

Those farmers know a lot more about whether leaving their crops to rot in the fields is the best option or not. You don't. You and your BA are talking out of your ass. They did the math, you didn't. You're an arrogant thug, who thinks his superficial knowledge of other people's business entitles him to a say on how that business is run.

Yes, leaving some of the crops to rot, and only picking the ones they can find cheap labor for, will lead to a better bottom line than hiring labor at five times the cost to pick them all. Any idiot with basic math skills could tell you that. It is called cutting your losses. Happens all the time.
When I was getting my BA in Business I seem to remember someone once telling me that a small profit is better than no profit
If a conversation includes the statement "a small profit is better than no profit", at least one of the parties has to be retarded. There is no way a mentally sound person says that to another mentally sound person, ever.
 
Feb 5, 2003
5,546
919
753
With a stranger
#23
I love that you got offended because I dismissed your questioning of actual, informed business owners' decisions. I apologize, you're right. You know better than they do, and no one should challenge you on that, because you have a BA in Business and they don't.

Those farmers know a lot more about whether leaving their crops to rot in the fields is the best option or not. You don't. You and your BA are talking out of your ass. They did the math, you didn't. You're an arrogant thug, who thinks his superficial knowledge of other people's business entitles him to a say on how that business is run.

Yes, leaving some of the crops to rot, and only picking the ones they can find cheap labor for, will lead to a better bottom line than hiring labor at five times the cost to pick them all. Any idiot with basic math skills could tell you that. It is called cutting your losses. Happens all the time.

If a conversation includes the statement "a small profit is better than no profit", at least one of the parties has to be retarded. There is no way a mentally sound person says that to another mentally sound person, ever.

I don't know why you have such a bug up your ass about anyone who thinks we shouldn't just allow anyone to cross our borders with no rules, but you seem to have that attitude whenever the subject comes up here. You instantly resort to name-calling instead of giving any reasons for your opinion, which makes it seem like you have no valid reason for your opinion or you have a bias on the issue that you don't want to disclose. Sorry, I can't justify letting employers to knowingly hire illegal immigrants because they can make a bigger profit that way. You have no evidence that a farmer hiring a legal worker won't make a profit--you just state as if it's a known fact and then insult anyone who dares to disagree. The only reason I even mentioned my degree is because you implied that I'm too stupid to understand the concept of income vs. expenses.

Those farmers didn't hire more people to pick those crops because they didn't want to py documented workers or U.S. citizens to do the job for them. To then turn around and complain about the inability to find workers due to their own refusal to hire legal workers is garbage. It seems like the author of that article wants me to feel sorry for them, but I don't at all.
 

Begbie

Wackbag Generalissimo
Jul 21, 2003
17,843
5,188
838
Wilmington, NC
#24
<peeks in thread, sees posts from Norm about illegal immigration, quietly exits thread> :icon_cool