Statement from WB:
Craig out, Cavill in.
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Let me throw this 100% wrong speculation out there, but it's fun so why not.
Craig out, Cavill in.
Craig out, Cavill in.
I don't know why DC has this fascination with making movies for characters that are already on television. Batman being the lone exception of course. They carved out a nice little niche for themselves with a mini DC universe to showcase the secondary characters. Let the big screen be for the A-list characters and maybe some lesser known properties.
Speaking of the DCWhateverse, I think they should put Batman and Superman on the shelf for a couple of years. Have WW 2, Aquaman, and Shazam be the start of a something new. The new thing should be standalone movies in a standalone universe. It worked for them in 1978 and 1989.
Speaking of the DCWhateverse, I think they should put Batman and Superman on the shelf for a couple of years. Have WW 2, Aquaman, and Shazam be the start of a something new. The new thing should be standalone movies in a standalone universe. It worked for them in 1978 and 1989.
Here's my two bits on continuing a shared universe or just saying fuck it, every movie takes place on a different Earth.
If you're not going to try to do what Marvel has done, then don't. But then don't try to compete with them, either. Marvel has found a way to make a shared universe work, and that shared universe is the number one and perhaps the ONLY reason that movies like Black Panther, Ant Man, Thor Ragnarok, Infinity War, Civil War, and many others work. A comic book movie that's completely self contained may or may not be a good idea creatively, but right now, being self contained definitely puts a cap on the box office potential.
So don't get pissed when Aquaman makes less than Ant Man and the Wasp. Don't get pissed when Wonder Woman 2 makes less than the first movie, because instead of continuing the story from Justice League, they made another self contained film set in the past. Don't expect the Joker movies - any of them - to make any money at all.
As long as they are happy and content with having lower budget movies that make less money, they can still tell good stories.
If you're not going to try to do what Marvel has done, then don't. But then don't try to compete with them, either. Marvel has found a way to make a shared universe work, and that shared universe is the number one and perhaps the ONLY reason that movies like Black Panther, Ant Man, Thor Ragnarok, Infinity War, Civil War, and many others work. A comic book movie that's completely self contained may or may not be a good idea creatively, but right now, being self contained definitely puts a cap on the box office potential.
So don't get pissed when Aquaman makes less than Ant Man and the Wasp. Don't get pissed when Wonder Woman 2 makes less than the first movie, because instead of continuing the story from Justice League, they made another self contained film set in the past. Don't expect the Joker movies - any of them - to make any money at all.
As long as they are happy and content with having lower budget movies that make less money, they can still tell good stories.
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I'd much rather them say fuck a connected universe and tell standalone stories with these characters with filmmakers who don't have to bother with Easter Eggs or worry how it meshes with Shazam. Maybe they can franchise individual characters, e.g. a Superman trilogy, but I don't need to see him hang out with Batman.
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Nothing about why any of the DCEU movies failed had anything to do with them being in a shared universe. They were just poorly conceived, poorly written, and poorly executed movies all on their own. So making future movies not be part of a shared universe, but not changing anything about the flawed way that they conceive, write, and execute their movies, is sort of like putting a band-aid on someone's finger hoping it will heal their broken leg. The shared universe isn't the problem. In actuality it might have been the only thing that worked in any of these movies. Shit, break it down.
Man of Steel - had a couple of Batman Easter Eggs and a few background references to other characters. Were any of those things the problem with the movie?
BvS - The YouTube scene was hilariously bad, but again - is that 90 second scene why the movie failed? Of course not. Most people agree that Wonder Woman was actually the best part of the movie, stupid theme song notwithstanding. Most people also agree that Batman's dream sequence with the Parademons and the hints at Darkseid were also great. Even the Flash thing was a cool easter egg. The problem wasn't bringing Batman and Superman together in a movie - they actually meshed very well as characters and looked "normal" standing next to each other. The problem was that they hadn't established either character enough, nor had they given them a reason to fight. And of course, they woefully miscast Lex Luthor and wrote his character about as poorly as they could. But take Batman and Wonder Woman out of the film and Lex is still a poorly written and acted character, and Superman is still all wrong, and still ends up being killed by Doomsday. All of those things were wrong. Even if it was the second movie in a Superman stand alone trilogy, killing him was always a bad idea.
Suicide Squad - There's no question the Batman and Flash cameos were some of the best parts of the movie. The post credits scene was again hilariously bad, but it would be pretty dishonest to say it ruined the whole movie.
Wonder Woman - the framing sequence with "letters from Bats" was weird and stupid, but I actually had to stop and try to remember them. I guess without the DCEU connections they could have set it in modern times, but would that have made the movie better? I don't see how it would have.
Justice League - again, when the characters all got together they meshed pretty well and it felt
The problem wasn't bringing them together, it was that they didn't establish three of them, and one of them was fucking dead when the movie started. Also, they tried to pretend Batman and Wonder Woman had this deep friendship that they also never established.
Rather than make broad statements, I prefer to look at each project individually.
I think they're making a mistake setting Wonder Woman in 1984.
Aquaman could be decent and there's no reason to jam in cameos or Easter Eggs. The movie takes place underwater for the most part. Fine.
I'd rather Shazam not be part of the DCEU in the same way I hope Deadpool stays on the fringes of the MCU. Like he can be part of it, but he should never be in a Justice League movie. Kind of like the Netflix shows and the MCU movies. (That's a bad example because I really want Daredevil to be in a Spider-Man movie.)
I think they're making a tragic mistake with the Joker standalone movie(s).
I think they're making a mistake if they don't tie a Supergirl movie into Superman and the DCEU.
I'm ok if they use Reeves' Batman to establish a separate Bat Universe, even Bruce Wayne is the only Bat person in it.
I also don't see the harm if they use the movie to soft reboot the character - making him younger but still part of the DCEU. Marvel recast the Hulk and Rhodey after all.
I think there's a lot more that can be done with Superman and hope they bring Cavill back, as he's not too old just yet. But if they decide to recast, that's fine too.
Man of Steel - had a couple of Batman Easter Eggs and a few background references to other characters. Were any of those things the problem with the movie?
BvS - The YouTube scene was hilariously bad, but again - is that 90 second scene why the movie failed? Of course not. Most people agree that Wonder Woman was actually the best part of the movie, stupid theme song notwithstanding. Most people also agree that Batman's dream sequence with the Parademons and the hints at Darkseid were also great. Even the Flash thing was a cool easter egg. The problem wasn't bringing Batman and Superman together in a movie - they actually meshed very well as characters and looked "normal" standing next to each other. The problem was that they hadn't established either character enough, nor had they given them a reason to fight. And of course, they woefully miscast Lex Luthor and wrote his character about as poorly as they could. But take Batman and Wonder Woman out of the film and Lex is still a poorly written and acted character, and Superman is still all wrong, and still ends up being killed by Doomsday. All of those things were wrong. Even if it was the second movie in a Superman stand alone trilogy, killing him was always a bad idea.
Suicide Squad - There's no question the Batman and Flash cameos were some of the best parts of the movie. The post credits scene was again hilariously bad, but it would be pretty dishonest to say it ruined the whole movie.
Wonder Woman - the framing sequence with "letters from Bats" was weird and stupid, but I actually had to stop and try to remember them. I guess without the DCEU connections they could have set it in modern times, but would that have made the movie better? I don't see how it would have.
Justice League - again, when the characters all got together they meshed pretty well and it felt
The problem wasn't bringing them together, it was that they didn't establish three of them, and one of them was fucking dead when the movie started. Also, they tried to pretend Batman and Wonder Woman had this deep friendship that they also never established.
Rather than make broad statements, I prefer to look at each project individually.
I think they're making a mistake setting Wonder Woman in 1984.
Aquaman could be decent and there's no reason to jam in cameos or Easter Eggs. The movie takes place underwater for the most part. Fine.
I'd rather Shazam not be part of the DCEU in the same way I hope Deadpool stays on the fringes of the MCU. Like he can be part of it, but he should never be in a Justice League movie. Kind of like the Netflix shows and the MCU movies. (That's a bad example because I really want Daredevil to be in a Spider-Man movie.)
I think they're making a tragic mistake with the Joker standalone movie(s).
I think they're making a mistake if they don't tie a Supergirl movie into Superman and the DCEU.
I'm ok if they use Reeves' Batman to establish a separate Bat Universe, even Bruce Wayne is the only Bat person in it.
I also don't see the harm if they use the movie to soft reboot the character - making him younger but still part of the DCEU. Marvel recast the Hulk and Rhodey after all.
I think there's a lot more that can be done with Superman and hope they bring Cavill back, as he's not too old just yet. But if they decide to recast, that's fine too.
I think DC needs to scrap all their plans and go with my idea.
I call it Camp Super.
It has all your favorite DC heroes as 10-12 year old kids. Superboy, Wondergirl, Aquaboy, Bat Boy and 'Lil Flashy. (Yes, I know some of these duplicate names of other canon characters. I don't care, nerds.)
The film takes place at a summer camp. There are also the bullies; Joker, Manta, Cheetah, Riddler and Captain Cold.
Lex Luther is the head of the camp, obviously.
Hi-jinx will ensue.
I call it Camp Super.
It has all your favorite DC heroes as 10-12 year old kids. Superboy, Wondergirl, Aquaboy, Bat Boy and 'Lil Flashy. (Yes, I know some of these duplicate names of other canon characters. I don't care, nerds.)
The film takes place at a summer camp. There are also the bullies; Joker, Manta, Cheetah, Riddler and Captain Cold.
Lex Luther is the head of the camp, obviously.
Hi-jinx will ensue.
And how come Starfire looks like a transexual prostitute?
Yeah that's going to make me sign up for a streaming service. It looks like a Syfy show that is supposed to be a take on the Teen Titans.
Also I know older actors and actresses sometimes play teenagers. But the woman who is playing Starfire looks like she is pushing 40.
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