Detroit back on top of most dangerous cities

abudabit

New Wackbag
Oct 10, 2004
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#1
DETROIT - In another blow to the Motor City's tarnished image, Detroit pushed past St. Louis to become the nation's most dangerous city, according to a private research group's controversial analysis, released Sunday, of annual FBI crime statistics.

The study drew harsh criticism even before it came out. The American Society of Criminology launched a pre-emptive strike Friday, issuing a statement attacking it as "an irresponsible misuse" of crime data.

The 14th annual "City Crime Rankings: Crime in Metropolitan America" was published by CQ Press, a unit of Congressional Quarterly Inc. It is based on the FBI's Sept. 24 crime statistics report.

The report looked at 378 cities with at least 75,000 people based on per-capita rates for homicide, ****, robbery, aggravated assault, burglary and auto theft. Each crime category was considered separately and weighted based on its seriousness, CQ Press said.

Last year's crime leader, St. Louis, fell to No. 2. Another Michigan city, Flint, ranked third, followed by Oakland Calif.; Camden, N.J.; Birmingham, Ala.; North Charleston, S.C.; Memphis, Tenn.; Richmond, Calif.; and Cleveland.

The study ranked Mission Viejo, Calif., as the safest U.S. city, followed by Clarkstown, N.Y.; Brick Township, N.J.; Amherst, N.Y.; and Sugar Land, Texas.

CQ Press spokesman Ben Krasney said details of the weighting system were proprietary. It was compiled by Kathleen O'Leary Morgan and Scott Morgan, whose Morgan Quitno Press published it until its acquisition by CQ Press.

The study assigns a crime score to each city, with zero representing the national average. Detroit got a score of 407, while St. Louis followed at 406. The score for Mission Viejo, in affluent Orange County, was minus 82.

Detroit was pegged the nation's murder capital in the 1980s and has lost nearly 1 million people since 1950, according to the Census Bureau. Downtown sports stadiums and corporate headquarters — along with the redevelopment of the riverfront of this city of 919,000 — have slowed but not reversed the decline. Officials have said crime reports don't help.

Detroit police officials released a statement Sunday night disputing the report, saying it fails to put crime information into proper context.

"Every year this organization sends out a press release with big, bold lettering that labels a certain city as Most Dangerous, USA," Police Chief Ella Bully-Cummings said in the release.

"It really makes you wonder if the organization is truly concerned with evaluating crime or increasing their profit," said Bully-Cummings, who noted the complete report is available only by purchase. "With crime experts across the country routinely denouncing the findings, I believe the answer is clear."

The mayor of 30th-ranked Rochester, N.Y. — an ex-police chief himself — said the study's authors should consider the harm that the report causes.

"What I take exception to is the use of these statistics and the damage they inflict on a number of these cities," said Mayor Robert Duffy, chairman of the Criminal and Social Justice Committee for the U.S. Conference of Mayors.

The rankings "do groundless harm to many communities," said Michael Tonry, president of the American Society of Criminology.

"They also work against a key goal of our society, which is a better understanding of crime-related issues by both scientists and the public," Tonry said.

Critics also complain that numbers don't tell the whole story because of differences among cities.

"You're not comparing apples and oranges; you're comparing watermelons and grapes," said Rob Casey, who heads the FBI section that puts out the Uniform Crime Report that provides the data for the Quitno report.

The FBI posted a statement on its Web site criticizing such use of its statistics.

"These rough rankings provide no insight into the numerous variables that mold crime in a particular town, city, county, state, or region," the FBI said. "Consequently, they lead to simplistic and/or incomplete analyses that often create misleading perceptions adversely affecting communities and their residents."

Doug Goldenberg-Hart, acquisitions editor at CQ Press, said that the rankings are imperfect, but that the numbers are straightforward. Cities at the top of the list would not be there unless they ranked poorly in all six crime categories, he said.

"The idea that people oppose it, it's kind of blaming the messenger," Goldenberg-Hart said. "It's not coming to terms with the idea that crime is a persistent problem in our society."

The report "helps concerned Americans learn how their communities fare in the fight against crime," CQ Press said in a statement. "The first step in making our cities and states safer is to understand the true magnitude of their crime problems. This will only be achieved through straightforward data that all of us can use and understand."

The study excluded Chicago, Minneapolis, and other Illinois and Minnesota cities because of incomplete data.

________________________________________

I wonder what happened to New Orleans. The murder rate is higher than Rio De Janero.
 

HummerTuesdays

Another girrrrl!!!
Apr 24, 2005
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#2
The report looked at 378 cities with at least 75,000 people based on per-capita rates for homicide, ****, robbery, aggravated assault, burglary and auto theft. Each crime category was considered separately and weighted based on its seriousness, CQ Press said.


I wonder what happened to New Orleans. The murder rate is higher than Rio De Janero.
Are there even 75k people left in NOLA? Maybe that's how they were left off the list.
 

abudabit

New Wackbag
Oct 10, 2004
14,802
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0
#3
I wish there were 2,000,000 people in New Orleans. 2,000,000 people and 1 nuclear bomb.
 

abudabit

New Wackbag
Oct 10, 2004
14,802
0
0
#4
"You're not comparing apples and oranges; you're comparing watermelons and grapes," said Rob Casey, who heads the FBI section that puts out the Uniform Crime Report that provides the data for the Quitno report.
:icon_lol:
 

weakside

He was stupid. I was lucky. I will visit him soon.
Dec 9, 2004
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California
#5
I definitely agree with Richmond, California. That city is a fucking war zone.
 

WhiskeyWhispers

I Want To Kill You All
Mar 11, 2007
3,544
3
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Jersey
#6
Gee, I wonder what all these cities have in common? What could possibly be the problem?

(Hint: they aren't italian, irish, german, polish, russian, dutch, asian, jewish, spanish, indian, middle eastern, polynesian, filipino, english, austrailian, aborigine, samoan, french, portuguese)

If only someone could figure it out.
 

weakside

He was stupid. I was lucky. I will visit him soon.
Dec 9, 2004
3,871
0
0
California
#7
Gee, I wonder what all these cities have in common? What could possibly be the problem?

(Hint: they aren't italian, irish, german, polish, russian, dutch, asian, jewish, spanish, indian, middle eastern, polynesian, filipino, english, austrailian, aborigine, samoan, french, portuguese)

If only someone could figure it out.
They have, and it has to do with social economics more than it does race.
 

WhiskeyWhispers

I Want To Kill You All
Mar 11, 2007
3,544
3
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Jersey
#8
Well, I'm broke and I don't kill people or rob and steal. In fact I know a lot of people who go to work every day and make nothing for it, and they are honest people. I can also say I never met anyone who was shot or who shot anyone else.

Why is that? If it's because they are poor, how come noone I know lives like that?

Excuses are for children.
 

Vyce

Light-skinned, with no Negro dialect.
Feb 11, 2006
8,171
10
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Washington D.C.
#9
They have, and it has to do with social economics more than it does race.
I'd like to see statistics comparing the crime rates for African-Americans and whites, in similarly situated socio-economic backgrounds / situations. In fact, I have seen those statistics before, and basically, the crime rate is higher with blacks.

Not because the race is any more violent than whites. But I think this "victim culture" nonsense that people like Al Sharpton and other racial demagogues have cultivated for several DECADES now (which was, in part, institutionalized by our own government, in years past, via the welfare system), is to blame for a lot of it. It's actually prevented African-Americans from eliminating a lot of the problems that their culture possesses. It's telling when people like Bill Cosby (and others - there are a lot of others, he's just one of the more notable individuals) speak honestly about the problems in the black community and how it needs to change, and he's shit on by a lot of other blacks for vocalizing those concerns.
 

weakside

He was stupid. I was lucky. I will visit him soon.
Dec 9, 2004
3,871
0
0
California
#10
Well, I'm broke and I don't kill people or rob and steal. In fact I know a lot of people who go to work every day and make nothing for it, and they are honest people. I can also say I never met anyone who was shot or who shot anyone else.

Why is that? If it's because they are poor, how come noone I know lives like that?

Excuses are for children.
And I was, and grew up around poor white trash and I can tell you that they committed plenty of crimes and I personally knew someone who shot at another person, and he was white.

But personal stories don't prove anything as their are plenty of examples that could falsely prove or disprove each of our views. Your right, excuses are for children. Being poor is not an excuse for committing crime. But the idea that the shade of melanoma in someone’s skin determines criminal mentality is crazy talk.

Poor, uneducated people are more likely to commit crime than educated successful people no matter what the race. Eliminating all other factors, a black baby has no more criminal potential than a white one.

Now, if you want to argue that for a multitude of factors Blacks are more likely to be poor and thus more likely to commit crime then that is a fair argument. But again, we are talking about social economic factors and not skin color per se.
 

Deadbent

You can go fuck.
Aug 19, 2005
13,047
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Chicago, IL. Southside, stupid.
#11
Well, looks we can all go back to waiting for someone to say blacks are statistically more criminal than non-blacks.


Looks like this one doesn't prove shit.
 

WhiskeyWhispers

I Want To Kill You All
Mar 11, 2007
3,544
3
0
Jersey
#12
Rednecks get drunk, slap around their fat wives, and steal tools from their neighbors shed. Of course they kill people too, but not to the extent that blacks do, and they don't have the benefit of people making excuses for them the way blacks do. I can't argue with you about that if you don't agree. We must exist on different planes of reality.

Of course not all blacks are criminals, but it's equally inane to think that there isn't a significant segment that are. The proof is in the pudding. I don't know why you have to be deemed a racist to point that out. In fact, if one were truly racist, wouldn't these crime statistics be a positive? Because if things continue the way they are, blacks are doomed. And what would please a racist white man more than the extinction of blacks, to watch them shoot themselves in the foot? If I were truly racist, I would grab my popcorn and watch them destroy themselves and do and say nothing about it.

Beleive it or not, I care about what is going on in this country in regard to race. I don't want to live in a world full of pain and death and suffering, I don't want to be weighed down by hate. It's enough to have to deal with people as just plain old asshole people than to add the extra element of ethnicity. Blacks and whites have been pitted against each other in America for far too long, and bleeding hearts are as much to blame as the KKK. I would like nothing more for this country's past to be just that, it's past. That is the only way to move forward. Blacks have to meet whites half way on this, because it isn't going to work any other way.

White people are already doing their part. They are positively tripping over themselves to apologize for any injustices done, even if they nor their families had anything to do with slavery. They adopt African children, ban words, fire people for racially insensitive remarks, pass laws to favor minorities, etc etc etc. Now it's the other side's turn. At some point, blacks need a prolific mouthpiece other than that fucking bloated head buffoon Sharpton and the equally phony Jesse Jackson to address the problems in
the ghettos across this country, because for every Bill Cosby their are a hundred Farrakhans, and if you come at me with an angry face and a loud voice, you can go fuck yourself. I for one can just as easily blow your fucking head off as shake your hand. The ball is in your court.

If that makes me a racist, then I guess I am.
 

Stormrider666

Hell is home.
Mar 19, 2005
28,286
2,885
673
Bronx, NY
#13
Gee, I wonder what all these cities have in common? What could possibly be the problem?

(Hint: they aren't italian, irish, german, polish, russian, dutch, asian, jewish, spanish, indian, middle eastern, polynesian, filipino, english, austrailian, aborigine, samoan, french, portuguese)

If only someone could figure it out.
If you're going to be a racist, just have the balls to come out and say black people, don't try to be witty about it.
 

weakside

He was stupid. I was lucky. I will visit him soon.
Dec 9, 2004
3,871
0
0
California
#17
I'd like to see statistics comparing the crime rates for African-Americans and whites, in similarly situated socio-economic backgrounds / situations. In fact, I have seen those statistics before, and basically, the crime rate is higher with blacks.

Not because the race is any more violent than whites. But I think this "victim culture" nonsense that people like Al Sharpton and other racial demagogues have cultivated for several DECADES now (which was, in part, institutionalized by our own government, in years past, via the welfare system), is to blame for a lot of it. It's actually prevented African-Americans from eliminating a lot of the problems that their culture possesses. It's telling when people like Bill Cosby (and others - there are a lot of others, he's just one of the more notable individuals) speak honestly about the problems in the black community and how it needs to change, and he's shit on by a lot of other blacks for vocalizing those concerns.
You bring up a lot of good points. I too can't stand the "victim culture" that exists. That is definitely a major part of the problem and I have to concede that cultural factors play a part here as well.

My point is that there is nothing inherent about skin color that predetermines your potential for criminality. Are black people more likely to be poor? Yes. Is there cultural factors that play a part? Yes. But does the color of your skin alone have anything to do with it? No.

You brought up that blacks, when compared to other races at the same income levels commit more crimes than other races. That is true up to a point because that is looking at families and/or individuals under the national median income, and there are way too many variables at play to simply stop there. Instead, when Sociologists and Criminologists study why people don't commit crime they find that no matter what the race, a person that is brought up with good values and earns at or above the national median income is much less likely to partake in criminal activity.

It is a subtle but highly important difference in the debate because if we are to address the problem of how to limit crime we need to look at the real causes of it. Not just what particular color of skin people have.
 

weakside

He was stupid. I was lucky. I will visit him soon.
Dec 9, 2004
3,871
0
0
California
#19
Look at it this way, does a higher percentage of the black population commit crime more frequently than whites? Yes.

But blacks also make up a higher percentage of those living under the median income, and a high percentage of those living under the median income do not have a high educational level or share the same social mores and values that those who are above.

That is the problem that needs to be addressed.
 

abudabit

New Wackbag
Oct 10, 2004
14,802
0
0
#20
A debate with out an answer. Chicken eater or the egg.

It would take some real research to get the answer to the question, and it's not possible to find an objective researcher on the subject, so let's not delve too deeply into this.

Just stay out of certain areas and everything is fine.
 

Vyce

Light-skinned, with no Negro dialect.
Feb 11, 2006
8,171
10
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Washington D.C.
#21
You bring up a lot of good points. I too can't stand the "victim culture" that exists. That is definitely a major part of the problem and I have to concede that cultural factors play a part here as well.

My point is that there is nothing inherent about skin color that predetermines your potential for criminality. Are black people more likely to be poor? Yes. Is there cultural factors that play a part? Yes. But does the color of your skin alone have anything to do with it? No.
That's what I said.

There's more violence among blacks than there is similarly situated whites. I'm not sure about other ethnic groups; I don't know how blacks stand up against (non-black) Hispanics, for example. But it doesn't have anything to do with the race itself, though. Unless you're talking about the HUMAN race, because as a whole we're an aggressive species.

You brought up that blacks, when compared to other races at the same income levels commit more crimes than other races. That is true up to a point because that is looking at families and/or individuals under the national median income, and there are way too many variables at play to simply stop there. Instead, when Sociologists and Criminologists study why people don't commit crime they find that no matter what the race, a person that is brought up with good values and earns at or above the national median income is much less likely to partake in criminal activity.

It is a subtle but highly important difference in the debate because if we are to address the problem of how to limit crime we need to look at the real causes of it. Not just what particular color of skin people have.
Well, that only feeds in to my earlier point about there being problems with black CULTURE that have not been adequately addressed. One of those being the fact that African-Americans have among the highest rates (if not THE highest) of single-parent families. I don't buy into that "it takes a village" bullshit regarding raising kids, but evidence has shown time and again that to turn out fairly even, kids really benefit the most out of having TWO parents involved in their lives, and a significant percentage of black children only have one parent raising them (usually the mother). And as such, they're not getting all of the, quote unquote "traditional values" that are conducive to leaving them with a healthy relationship with society.

And, again, when a prominent black American - to again reference Bill Cosby - brings that sort of problem up (i.e. "How come so many black men are abandoning their parental responsibilities?"), and talks about how it's a serious issue which needs to be addressed, more often than not THEY are the ones who are attacked (by other members of the black community) for being to negative.
 

Stormrider666

Hell is home.
Mar 19, 2005
28,286
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Bronx, NY
#22
That's what I said.

There's more violence among blacks than there is similarly situated whites. I'm not sure about other ethnic groups; I don't know how blacks stand up against (non-black) Hispanics, for example. But it doesn't have anything to do with the race itself, though. Unless you're talking about the HUMAN race, because as a whole we're an aggressive species.



Well, that only feeds in to my earlier point about there being problems with black CULTURE that have not been adequately addressed. One of those being the fact that African-Americans have among the highest rates (if not THE highest) of single-parent families. I don't buy into that "it takes a village" bullshit regarding raising kids, but evidence has shown time and again that to turn out fairly even, kids really benefit the most out of having TWO parents involved in their lives, and a significant percentage of black children only have one parent raising them (usually the mother). And as such, they're not getting all of the, quote unquote "traditional values" that are conducive to leaving them with a healthy relationship with society.

And, again, when a prominent black American - to again reference Bill Cosby - brings that sort of problem up (i.e. "How come so many black men are abandoning their parental responsibilities?"), and talks about how it's a serious issue which needs to be addressed, more often than not THEY are the ones who are attacked (by other members of the black community) for being to negative.
That is one of the main things I hate about our community. The so called leaders, Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson(I refuse to call them Revs) won't address the real problems facing the community. Not only that the fucking media constantly panders to them and will run to them as the sole leaders in the black community. Roy Innis, the head of C.O.R.E.,bought up the fact that Imus could have came to him, instead of going to Sharpton. Its time the media start giving more attention to guys like J.C. Watts and Alan Keyes, instead of just playing into Sharpton and Jackson's hands. Finally I think the main problem is that once Martin Luther King Jr. and Malcom X were killed, there was no left to fill the void of leadership and say what the next plan was after achieveing the goals of 1964.
 

weakside

He was stupid. I was lucky. I will visit him soon.
Dec 9, 2004
3,871
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California
#23
Lots of good points were made and as abudabit alluded to, there really isn’t one definitive answer. It would be great if we could solve a problem in one thread what researchers for decades have not been able to but it isn’t going to happen.

However, I think honesty more so than political correctness is a good starting point for both sides:

Blacks need to be honest and take ownership of their child’s education. Education means not only the promotion of formal education but also supporting the educational system, monitoring who their children associate with, and providing a good role model at home. They also need to stop blaming and take ownership of their own problems and failures.

Whites need to be honest and admit that decades of racism and discrimination against blacks in this country hindered their ability to achieve and created a cycle of generational poverty that they are still trying to break free of. Progress is happening, but it is going to take a lot longer than a couple of generations to undo the damage.

Oh, and to bring this full circle, fuck Detroit. The Tigers suck balls.
 

Myhairygrundle

Screw you guys, I'm going home.
Jul 16, 2005
6,798
1,947
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#24
Look at it this way, does a higher percentage of the black population commit crime more frequently than whites? Yes.

But blacks also make up a higher percentage of those living under the median income, and a high percentage of those living under the median income do not have a high educational level or share the same social mores and values that those who are above.

That is the problem that needs to be addressed.
Are you serious? Give them money and they blow it on rims and flat screen tv's. Where do you think the term "Ni*ger rich" comes from?

Look at hip-hop "artists" who have tons of cash, but still are criminals. You can dress a monkey up in a suit, but it's still a monkey and will shit on the floor.


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