New Buchanan Book Declares 'end Of America'

Budyzir

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Nov 12, 2004
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While I am no supporter of Pat Buchanan, I have to say he does raise some excellent points.

"America is coming apart, decomposing, and...the likelihood of her survival as one nation...is improbable -- and impossible if America continues on her current course," declares Pat Buchanan. "For we are on a path to national suicide."

The best-selling author and former presidential candidate is on the eve of launching his new epic book: DAY OF RECKONING: HOW HUBRIS, IDEOLOGY AND GREED ARE TEARING AMERICA APART.

[The book's release date has been moved up to this week. It ranked #237 on AMAZON's hitparade Monday morning.]

This time, Buchanan goes all the way:

"America is in an existential crisis from which the nation may not survive."

The U.S. Army is breaking and is too small to meet America’s global commitments.

The dollar has sunk to historic lows and is being abandoned by foreign governments.

U.S. manufacturing is being hollowed out.

The greatest invasion in history, from the Third World, is swamping the ethno-cultural core of the country, leading to Balkanization and the loss of the Southwest to Mexico.


The culture is collapsing and the nation is being deconstructed along the lines of race and class.

A fiscal crisis looms as the unfunded mandates of Social Security and Medicare remain unaddressed.

All these crises are hitting America at once -- a perfect storm of crises.

Specifically, Buchanan contends:

• Pax Americana, the era of U.S. global dominance, is over. A struggle for global hegemony has begun among the United States, China, a resurgent Russia and radical Islam

• Bush’s invasion of Iraq was a product of hubris and of ideology, a secular religion of “democratism,” to which Bush was converted in the days following 9/11

• Torn asunder by a culture war, America has now begun to break down along class, ethnic and racial lines.

• The greatest threat to U.S. sovereignty and independence is the scheme of a global elite to erase America’s borders and merge the USA, Mexico and Canada into a North American Union.

• Free trade is shipping jobs, factories and technology to China and plunging America into permanent dependency and unpayable debt. One of every six U.S. manufacturing jobs vanished under Bush

• “Sovereign Wealth Funds,” controlled by foreign regimes and stuffed with trillions of dollars from U.S. trade deficits, are buying up strategic corporate assets vital to America’s security

• As U.S. wages are stagnant, corporate CEOs are raking in rising pay and benefits 400 to 500 times that of their workers

• The Third World invasion through Mexico is a graver threat to our survival as one nation than anything happening in Afghanistan or Iraq

* European-Americans, 89% of the nation when JFK took the oath, are now 66% and sinking. Before 2050, America is a Third World nation

• By 2060, America will add 167 million people and 105 million immigrants will be here, triple the 37 million today.

• Hispanics will be over 100 million in 2050 and concentrated in a Southwest most Mexicans believe belongs to them

Buchanan’s Recommendations:

• A new foreign-defense policy that closes most of the 1000 bases overseas, reviews all alliances, and brings home U.S. troops

• A purge of neoconservative ideology and the “Cakewalk” crowd” from national power.

• To avert a second Cold War, the United States should “get out of Russia’s space and get out of Russia’s face,” and shut down all U.S. bases on the soil of the former Soviet Union

• To reach a cold peace in the culture war, Buchanan urges a return to federalism and the overthrow of our judicial dictatorship by Congressionally mandated restrictions on the jurisdiction of the Supreme Court.

• To end the trade deficits and save the dollar, Buchanan urges a Hamiltonian solution: a 20% Border Equity Tax on imports, with the $500 billion raised to be used to end taxation on American producers

• To prevent America becoming “a tangle of squabbling nationalities” Buchanan urges: No amnesty for the 12-20 million illegal aliens; a border fence from San Diego to Brownsville; Congressional declarations that children born to illegal aliens are not citizens and English is the language of the United States; and a “timeout” on all immigration.
http://www.drudgereport.com/flash9pb.htm
 

Budyzir

There's nothing quite like a shorn scrotum.
Nov 12, 2004
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I hear ya, I'm thinking about picking it too.
 

Your_Moms_Box

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Dec 20, 2004
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#5
A point by point agree/disagree.


I will use italics for disagree, and bold for agree.


"America is in an existential crisis from which the nation may not survive."
The U.S. Army is breaking and is too small to meet America’s global commitments.The dollar has sunk to historic lows and is being abandoned by foreign governments.
U.S. manufacturing is being hollowed out.
The greatest invasion in history, from the Third World, is swamping the ethno-cultural core of the country, leading to Balkanization and the loss of the Southwest to Mexico.
The culture is collapsing and the nation is being deconstructed along the lines of race and class.
(I agree with classism, but disagree that this is somehow new or unusual. there has been classism since america's inception, feel free to look up the womens suffrage movement and the abolishan of slavery for some references.)

A fiscal crisis looms as the unfunded mandates of Social Security and Medicare remain unaddressed.
(This "Crisis" is easily solvable.... 1 - stop borrowing the money for pet projects, 2 - Tie the tax rate into the inflation rate on a permamnent basis.)

All these crises are hitting America at once -- a perfect storm of crises.

Specifically, Buchanan contends:

• Pax Americana, the era of U.S. global dominance, is over. A struggle for global hegemony has begun among the United States, China, a resurgent Russia and radical Islam
• Bush’s invasion of Iraq was a product of hubris and of ideology, a secular religion of “democratism,” to which Bush was converted in the days following 9/11
(Bush wasn't converted... He just found a good oppourtunity.

• Torn asunder by a culture war, America has now begun to break down along class, ethnic and racial lines.
HELTER SKELTER Y'ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!

• The greatest threat to U.S. sovereignty and independence is the scheme of a global elite to erase America’s borders and merge the USA, Mexico and Canada into a North American Union.
• Free trade is shipping jobs, factories and technology to China and plunging America into permanent dependency and unpayable debt. One of every six U.S. manufacturing jobs vanished under Bush
• “Sovereign Wealth Funds,” controlled by foreign regimes and stuffed with trillions of dollars from U.S. trade deficits, are buying up strategic corporate assets vital to America’s security
• As U.S. wages are stagnant, corporate CEOs are raking in rising pay and benefits 400 to 500 times that of their workers
• The Third World invasion through Mexico is a graver threat to our survival as one nation than anything happening in Afghanistan or Iraq
(I particularly LOVE LOVE LOVE that the people of Buchanan's Ilk will immediatly blame the mexican who tries to live the american dream instead of the corrupt system that rewards those who strive to produce nothing.)

* European-Americans, 89% of the nation when JFK took the oath, are now 66% and sinking. Before 2050, America is a Third World nation
(READ: Helter Skelter!!!!!!!! Only whites can solve any problems)

• By 2060, America will add 167 million people and 105 million immigrants will be here, triple the 37 million today.
• Hispanics will be over 100 million in 2050 and concentrated in a Southwest most Mexicans believe belongs to them
(Huh, well... I suppose if you look back historically, It really did... but again.. this is just veiled racism)

Buchanan’s Recommendations:

• A new foreign-defense policy that closes most of the 1000 bases overseas, reviews all alliances, and brings home U.S. troops
• A purge of neoconservative ideology and the “Cakewalk” crowd” from national power.
AMEN!!!!

• To avert a second Cold War, the United States should “get out of Russia’s space and get out of Russia’s face,” and shut down all U.S. bases on the soil of the former Soviet Union
• To reach a cold peace in the culture war, Buchanan urges a return to federalism and the overthrow of our judicial dictatorship by Congressionally mandated restrictions on the jurisdiction of the Supreme Court.
(READ: Throw out checks and balances and let Uncle Pat lead the way.....)

• To end the trade deficits and save the dollar, Buchanan urges a Hamiltonian solution: a 20% Border Equity Tax on imports, with the $500 billion raised to be used to end taxation on American producers
(Although not a fan of taxes and tarrifs, I think we should impose them on nations that don't meet basic labor standards, and should publicly execute CEO's of american companies that outsource jobs there)

• To prevent America becoming “a tangle of squabbling nationalities” Buchanan urges: No amnesty for the 12-20 million illegal aliens; a border fence from San Diego to Brownsville; Congressional declarations that children born to illegal aliens are not citizens and English is the language of the United States; and a “timeout” on all immigration.
(It's a shame that after every somewhat good idea, he reverts into babbling racism about the dirty "non-Whites" destroying the world)
 

Vyce

Light-skinned, with no Negro dialect.
Feb 11, 2006
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#6
More of the same racist, xenophobic bullshit from this asshole.
 

MrAbovePar

En Taro Anthony
Mar 14, 2005
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#7
Huh, well... I suppose if you look back historically, It really did...
Technically no. Mexico was a sovereign nation for less than 2 decades before losing control of the Southwest. France and Spain controlled the region longer than Mexico did.
 

Kris_LTRMa

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Nov 17, 2006
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#8

LiddyRules

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Jun 1, 2005
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Well I can finally agree with Pat Buchanan on something. That and how gays are evil. I really want to see how this country ends. And it will, sooner than later.
 

Your_Moms_Box

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Dec 20, 2004
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#10
I read his last book State of Emergency: The Third World Invasion and Conquest of America and he does make some very valid points about illegal immigration. Whether or not you want to admit it, there is a problem and it really has to be addressed, especially in the border states where our agents are being killed by these people.
wa wa wa what?



ok.. does immigration need to be addressed? - Yes

do I place any blame on people who try to leave a third world country for a place where they think they will be able to provide a better life for their children? - Absolutly not.


where is the problem then?

2 places...

1 - companies that hire "illegal aliens" so that they can pay them below minimum wage and avoid taxes.

and

2 - not having a realistic and simple screening method that allows those who want to come here do it legally just like ALL OF OUR ANCESTERS did. (Unless you are black, in which case they might have gotten here in a totally different way)

I think anyone who wants to come here has more of the american spirit than most of the dumb asses we have here already.
 

ruckstande

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Apr 2, 2005
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I think anyone who wants to come here has more of the american spirit than most of the dumb asses we have here already.
Negative Ghost Rider, most who come here illegally have no American spirit or sense of integration whatsoever. English should be mandatory and it isn't and it is constantly being fought against. When they come here they don't come here to live they come to support their Mexican lifestyle in their country of Mexico, not the United States.
 

mendozathejew

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Mar 12, 2005
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#12
Buchanan has been arguing the end of the American empire for many years now. especially on these two points


• The greatest threat to U.S. sovereignty and independence is the scheme of a global elite to erase America’s borders and merge the USA, Mexico and Canada into a North American Union.

• Free trade is shipping jobs, factories and technology to China and plunging America into permanent dependency and unpayable debt. One of every six U.S. manufacturing jobs vanished under Bush
 

Your_Moms_Box

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#13
Negative Ghost Rider, most who come here illegally have no American spirit or sense of integration whatsoever. English should be mandatory and it isn't and it is constantly being fought against. When they come here they don't come here to live they come to support their Mexican lifestyle in their country of Mexico, not the United States.
Go watch gangs of new york.

It's been a long tradition of people who immigrate here trying to maintain their culture.

In some ways they succede, and in other ways they adapt to the status quo.... they contribute to and eat from the melting pot that is AMERICA.




I never understood the moron argument that because they don't speak English that they must be worthless.


Why don't you as an adult try to learn another language? The reason they come here is so that they can provide a better oppourtunity for THEIR CHILDREN.

Their children do learn English.



Also, if your argument is with the fact that the companies all have "Press # for Spanish" that isn't because they demand it, it's because companies saw an oppoutunity to make more money by catering to them.


They don't force companies to cater, companies do it because they see profit.



And if you are refering to "Lobbying" or "Human Interest" groups that push for bi-lingualism...... Look at the membership, it's all guilty white peole, not the immigrants that are killing chickens and shoveling shit for a living for their children to have oppourtunities.






And... for the record.... There is no "Official American Language" and if there was, I'd vote for "Navajo" not "English"

Even though Columbus was an Italian sailor who came here on funding from the Spanish Empire.... so logically we should speak Italian or Spanish and not English....



Or Norse....
 

mendozathejew

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I think without white guilt, and outsourcing of jobs, this discussion would not happen. it wouldnt be needed
 

Kris_LTRMa

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Nov 17, 2006
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Go watch gangs of new york.

It's been a long tradition of people who immigrate here trying to maintain their culture.

In some ways they succede, and in other ways they adapt to the status quo.... they contribute to and eat from the melting pot that is AMERICA.

I never understood the moron argument that because they don't speak English that they must be worthless.

Why don't you as an adult try to learn another language? The reason they come here is so that they can provide a better oppourtunity for THEIR CHILDREN.

Their children do learn English.

Also, if your argument is with the fact that the companies all have "Press # for Spanish" that isn't because they demand it, it's because companies saw an oppoutunity to make more money by catering to them.

They don't force companies to cater, companies do it because they see profit.

And if you are refering to "Lobbying" or "Human Interest" groups that push for bi-lingualism...... Look at the membership, it's all guilty white peole, not the immigrants that are killing chickens and shoveling shit for a living for their children to have oppourtunities.

And... for the record.... There is no "Official American Language" and if there was, I'd vote for "Navajo" not "English"

Even though Columbus was an Italian sailor who came here on funding from the Spanish Empire.... so logically we should speak Italian or Spanish and not English....

Or Norse....
I'm all for immigration, just wait your turn like those before you. What gives you the right to cross the border without having the "permission" of this government to do so? And now that you are here, why do I have to pay for you to eat and for your medical care?

Now, as for there being no "official American language" you are correct. However, it is understood that in America we speak english. Therefore, it is the unofficial official language of America. If I were to move to Mexico, or even to Saudi Arabia, I would have to learn the language. I would not be able to press 2 for English. We do it here because somewhere along the line, some bleeding heart decided that we were violating the "civil rights" of these illegals by not having someone speak their language. Where were the Italian & German speaking operators when they immigrated (legally, I might add) to this country? Answer: they didn't exist, so the newly arrived learned to speak the language of their adopted homeland.

Yes, it's difficult to learn a language, especially as an adult, and english is the most difficult language to learn because of all it's nuances. But people do learn it. My great grandparents came here from Italy. It was hard not knowing the language. It was hard trying to assimilate. But they did it. Why? Because they wanted to be Americans. My great grandfathers went to work, they learned the language, they insisted that english be spoken at home. My father told us that his grandfather & grandmother didn't speak for an entire week once. Why? Because great grandma was a housewife. Her proficiency of english wasn't as good as great grandpa's. She said something to him in Italian and he flipped out. He told her that they were in America and in America they speak english & if she wasn't going to speak to him in english she shouldn't speak to him at all. Took the woman a week to figure out how to say whatever it was that she needed to say to him, but she did it.

Meantime, my church's parish outreach ministry gives Thanksgiving dinners to families that are registered with them. This year we gave out over 700 turkey dinners. A woman came into the office a day and a half after everything was given out looking for her dinner package. Not only had she been in the country over 6 years and spoke not one lick of english, but her child, who was about 5, spoke no english to even translate what this woman was looking for. It was only because I learned a second language (which I choose not to use for the most part) that I was able to help her.

Columbus did not discover the American mainland. He landed on San Salvado Island, which is actually in the Bahamas. That's number one. The British were actually the first to step foot on the mainland (other than the Indians). They settled in Jamestown and then in Plymouth. The British spoke english. That's number two.
 

Your_Moms_Box

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#17
I'm all for immigration, just wait your turn like those before you. What gives you the right to cross the border without having the "permission" of this government to do so? And now that you are here, why do I have to pay for you to eat and for your medical care?
Well, silly liberla me... I think we should all pay for everyones health care... I think it's insane that we don't have universal health care yet.

Also, I stated that we need to make a legal or "permissable" path for these people to come into the country.

The problem isn't the "illegals" it's the companies that shelter them and pay them under the table.


Now, as for there being no "official American language" you are correct. However, it is understood that in America we speak english. Therefore, it is the unofficial official language of America.
It still isn't official.

If I were to move to Mexico, or even to Saudi Arabia, I would have to learn the language. I would not be able to press 2 for English. We do it here because somewhere along the line, some bleeding heart decided that we were violating the "civil rights" of these illegals by not having someone speak their language. Where were the Italian & German speaking operators when they immigrated (legally, I might add) to this country? Answer: they didn't exist, so the newly arrived learned to speak the language of their adopted homeland.
Actually, if you went to those countries you, for the most part, would not have as much trouble as a non-english speaking person does here, because they actually teach most of their students English along with their language..... Not that I'm sugggesting that our academic system is as broken and sub-par as our health insurance.

Also, back in that time, blacks were slaves, women were barely better, and people died of cholera and scarlet fever... good times :)

Yes, it's difficult to learn a language, especially as an adult, and english is the most difficult language to learn because of all it's nuances. But people do learn it. My great grandparents came here from Italy. It was hard not knowing the language. It was hard trying to assimilate. But they did it. Why? Because they wanted to be Americans. My great grandfathers went to work, they learned the language, they insisted that english be spoken at home. My father told us that his grandfather & grandmother didn't speak for an entire week once. Why? Because great grandma was a housewife. Her proficiency of english wasn't as good as great grandpa's. She said something to him in Italian and he flipped out. He told her that they were in America and in America they speak english & if she wasn't going to speak to him in english she shouldn't speak to him at all. Took the woman a week to figure out how to say whatever it was that she needed to say to him, but she did it.

Meantime, my church's parish outreach ministry gives Thanksgiving dinners to families that are registered with them. This year we gave out over 700 turkey dinners. A woman came into the office a day and a half after everything was given out looking for her dinner package. Not only had she been in the country over 6 years and spoke not one lick of english, but her child, who was about 5, spoke no english to even translate what this woman was looking for. It was only because I learned a second language (which I choose not to use for the most part) that I was able to help her.
That's sweet... you gave out turkeys. I live in an area with a lot of mexicans (I think they are actually guatamalans) And for the most part almost all of them can speak enough English to communicate, and if they can't, for the most part their kids speak enough to translate....

at 5, the child you saw wasn't even in school yet, or was just in kindergarten, so i'm not surprised that she couldn't yet speak fluent enough to translate. Give her time.....


Again, I will tolerate her parents to give her a chance to have the same oppourtunities I have had my entire life, and I am happy that they want that oppourtunity for their children.

Columbus did not discover the American mainland. He landed on San Salvado Island, which is actually in the Bahamas. That's number one. The British were actually the first to step foot on the mainland (other than the Indians). They settled in Jamestown and then in Plymouth. The British spoke english. That's number two.

I was joking with the columbus statements... But I do believe that Ponce De Leon was the first (excluding indians) to explore florida and the US mainland....

Settled, schmettled





Oh wait....


I just noticed that your WOW logo is upside down and it says MOM


that's A DORE ABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Southtown

Registered User
Aug 10, 2004
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#18
I am so tired of all the Timmy Technicals in this country. "Well technically there is no offiicial language in America". Who give a shit that it isnt written down somewhere, its fucking english, learn it if you want to do anything with your life here.

And stop bring the children into every arguement. So I can go to your house open the fridge and take out food as long as I say its for my children. I dont think so.

I work with alot of LEGAL immigrants and while they are nice and hard working they feel no loyalty to America. I heard one say they would never become an American, and they said with tone that would make you think they hate America. And pretty much all of them have nothing nice to say about America in general.

So I want to thank all the assholes that think we should change our laws to help cater to people who dont like our country.

If saying that makes me a racist, then say hello to a racist.
 

Kris_LTRMa

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Nov 17, 2006
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#19
Well, silly liberla me... I think we should all pay for everyones health care... I think it's insane that we don't have universal health care yet.
While I don't agree with a universal health plan, fine if you want one. BUT don't hand me crap about paying for an illegal's health care. They are not entitled to anything.

Also, I stated that we need to make a legal or "permissable" path for these people to come into the country.
We already have a legal and "permissable" path for these people to come into the country. If we didn't, all of the immigrants in the country would be here illegally and that's not the case. Let them wait in line the rest of the people wanting to come here.

The problem isn't the "illegals" it's the companies that shelter them and pay them under the table.
The problem is also the illegals. They know that once they get here we won't do anything to get rid of them. They flock to states and cities that they know are sanctuary states/cities. Where even if they get arrested for stealing or other crime, they won't be prosecuted for their crime of being here illegally. They also know that even without the proper paperwork they will be given assistance at the local welfare agencies and/or the churches.

It still isn't official.
I didn't say english was the official language. I said that since our founding fathers spoke english and those who came after them learned the english language, it's the unofficial language. Actually I said it was the unofficial official language. And technically it is since that's what we've spoken for hundreds of years.

Actually, if you went to those countries you, for the most part, would not have as much trouble as a non-english speaking person does here, because they actually teach most of their students English along with their language..... Not that I'm sugggesting that our academic system is as broken and sub-par as our health insurance.
If this were the case, then those coming into this country would speak english. Maybe not fluently, but a foundation on which to build. But they don't. Our education system is broken but not because we don't teach our children to speak a foreign language. It's broken because in order to not make kids feel stupid, rather than challenge to kids to learn, we've dumbed things down. This way all kids grow up thinking they're Einsteins.

Also, back in that time, blacks were slaves, women were barely better, and people died of cholera and scarlet fever... good times :)
That makes no difference with regards to whether or not our ancestors came here and assimilated into the culture that is America. They become one with the so-called melting pot.

That's sweet... you gave out turkeys. I live in an area with a lot of mexicans (I think they are actually guatamalans) And for the most part almost all of them can speak enough English to communicate, and if they can't, for the most part their kids speak enough to translate.... at 5, the child you saw wasn't even in school yet, or was just in kindergarten, so i'm not surprised that she couldn't yet speak fluent enough to translate. Give her time.....
while this is somewhat sarcastic, yeah, it is sweet that we gave out turkeys. We also gave out the rest of the food to go with an "American" Thanksgiving. Our food pantry and outreach program serve over 1000 people a month. There will be over 1500 kids who will receive Christmas gifts because of the "sweetness" that is my parish church. That's a simplistic definition. If you want me to send you the most recent grant request I had to type for the director of outreach I'll gladly send it to you.

The 5 year old would have had at least a year and a half of schooling ... our district has pre-kindergarten. Problem is, the kids learn english at school but then go home and speak their family's language and the english is not reinforced.

Again, I will tolerate her parents to give her a chance to have the same oppourtunities I have had my entire life, and I am happy that they want that oppourtunity for their children.
The opportunities I have had my entire life have been because because my ancestors came here legally. If these people want their children to have opportunities, then, again, come in legally - wait your turn like everyone else who wants their children to live the "American dream"

I was joking with the columbus statements... But I do believe that Ponce De Leon was the first (excluding indians) to explore florida and the US mainland....

Settled, schmettled
Ponce De Leon explored Florida BUT it was still the english speaking British who settled here. If it had been De Leon, we'd all be speaking Spanish. But we speak english.

Oh wait....

I just noticed that your WOW logo is upside down and it says MOM


that's A DORE ABLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This could be another snarky comment, but okay. Yes, it says MOM ... most everyone here calls me Ma and I go along with it because I'm a good egg.

Now, behave yourself or I will have to put you over my knee and spank you :action-sm
 

Don the Radio Guy

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#20
Please don't forget that the last time Pat ran for president, his running mate was a bona-fide Communist. He's fucking insane.

Having said that, he makes a lot of sense with some of that stuff.
 

Kris_LTRMa

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#21
I didn't know that, Don.

But I agree, he does make some valid points. And while I haven't gotten his new book yet, as I said earlier, I read his last book and it was a real eye opener.

Buchanan's on Glenn Beck tonight for a 1/2 hour. Beck's on CNN Headlines at 7, 9 & midnight. I'll be catching the 9 o'clock replay
 

fothermucker

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Aug 31, 2002
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#22
We already have a legal and "permissable" path for these people to come into the country. If we didn't, all of the immigrants in the country would be here illegally and that's not the case. Let them wait in line the rest of the people wanting to come here.
It's hard for someone to "wait in line" for the legal path considering they live in poverty and therefore don't have 1) time and 2) money. I suppose your answer to that would be "tough shit", but what have you done to "deserve" citizenship? You were born here. A twist of cosmic fate that you got shoved out of a vagina on a certain side of an invisible line. Other people shouldn't have your opportunities because of being birthed somewhere else? We're all people regardless of nationality.

The two major problems I see anti-immigration people bring up are 1) lack of security on our borders and 2) "free loading immigrants". You know the best way to combat this? Legalize and document every illegal immigrant. This means that 1) they can immediately begin paying taxes without fear of deportation and 2) the US documents all the people who WANT to be in the U.S. and therefore can focus on finding and dealing with those who evade registration and therefore have a reason NOT to be documented. If people would get over this perverse sense of entitlement due to birthright, we could solve 2 major problems in one move.
 

Your_Moms_Box

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#23
Now, behave yourself or I will have to put you over my knee and spank you :action-sm
How the hell am I supposed to type out a rational arument when I'm turned on!!!!!!!!!!




I threw the sarcasm in to try to keep it friendly.

I think your entitled to your opinion just as I am mine. We will never agree because the root of the isue stems from things we have opposing feelings on.


I agree with fothermucker on this one... You make the argument that they should come here "legally" but most of these people don't have the knwledge or ability to do that.

Again, as a parent, I want every oppourtunity possible for my child, and unfortunatly I don't feel like enough of an elitist to want that deprived for anyone.



This is such a soap box issue though... It's like abortion, people have strong opinions on it but the nature of our fucked up political system dictates that it won't change... ever....
 

Southtown

Registered User
Aug 10, 2004
1,185
220
588
#24
It's hard for someone to "wait in line" for the legal path considering they live in poverty and therefore don't have 1) time and 2) money. I suppose your answer to that would be "tough shit", but what have you done to "deserve" citizenship? You were born here. A twist of cosmic fate that you got shoved out of a vagina on a certain side of an invisible line. Other people shouldn't have your opportunities because of being birthed somewhere else? We're all people regardless of nationality.


I think youre arguement is really weak. Its like this in other countries too.

Its not like Americans are free to roam other countries and have the same rights and privledges as those born there. I cant move to Canada, France, Germany, or anywhere else in the world and be like "I'm here to stay", without going through the immigration process, so why should we have this open border.

Again, I cannot understand why people want us to show these illegals all this respect, when they are showing us none by breaking our laws.

I hope everyone that panders to illegals gets there house broken into and emptied by a bunch of illegals, and then when they are crying I can walk up and say "There not bad people, they are hard working people just looking for a better life for their children, what right to you have to deny them that".
 

fothermucker

I am thy labyrinth
Aug 31, 2002
1,276
0
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Deutschland
#25
I think youre arguement is really weak. Its like this in other countries too.

Its not like Americans are free to roam other countries and have the same rights and privledges as those born there. I cant move to Canada, France, Germany, or anywhere else in the world and be like "I'm here to stay", without going through the immigration process, so why should we have this open border.
How long are Americans going to keep parroting the line that our country is the greatest country in the world and stands out from the world community, but without actually doing anything or supporting anything that would seperate it from the world community?

Again, I cannot understand why people want us to show these illegals all this respect, when they are showing us none by breaking our laws.
I don't feel disrespected that a person is willing to go to such great lengths to come to MY country because they think they have a chance for themselves or their children to live a better life than before. Regardless, most of them break the law insofar as they disregard immigration procedure then come here looking for an honest living. You complain that they don't pay taxes or work for cheap, but if we followed my plan, we would make them normal, tax-paying citizens and remove this problem.

I hope everyone that panders to illegals gets there house broken into and emptied by a bunch of illegals, and then when they are crying I can walk up and say "There not bad people, they are hard working people just looking for a better life for their children, what right to you have to deny them that".
This type of fear mongering is no less dispicable than what you see from the White House or Rudy "elect me or face terrorist attacks" Guiliani. Plus, my plan already focused on finding and controlling the bad elements of the illegal immigrant population. If we register those who are willing to work and live here law abidingly and just want to pursue "the American dream", the police will have an easier time policing the criminal elements. It's a simple and effective solution.

In my opinion, the entire arguments of anti-immigration people boil down to one thing: they want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to complain about how terrible immigrants are and how they are running around undocumented and breaking laws and not paying taxes, but they don't want to consider a practical solution to the problem, instead opting to use loaded language and call illegal immigration an "invasion" or supporting pipe-dream ideas like building a (REALLY TALL) fence which would only waste our money further and still be left unpatrolled.