HitW Viewing Thread 11/20/18 - Kingsman: The Golden Circle, starring the return of Neon! (Maybe!)

LiddyRules

RIP King of France. Gutted Like Fish Under R Line
Had to quickly walk the dog and go to bed but I really need to reiterate how bad this was. I would love to hear some behind the scenes info on this. I seriously cannot believe that this was a Matthew Vaughn project and had the same cowriter as the first one. WHAT WERE THEY THINKING???

This movie did the thing that Fantastic Beasts did that really bugged me only even worse in a way - they tried to create an American equivalent of a British thing but did not bother to give it the same treatment. They just went with skin deep tropes that made the Americans seem crass cowboys, one of whom was a buffoon that spent most of the movie in cryo, and the other was a secret villain who wanted all drug users to die horribly.

The entire "fuck the hechman's girlfriend and stick a disease up her vagina" was perhaps the most tasteless thing I've seen in a movie that isn't The Brothers Grimsby or something comparable. I scoffed at the anal sex controversy from the first one, but seriously this deserves any kind of social commentary criticism it received. There was no reason for it, it wasn't funny or just a throwaway line - it was a major plot point that could have easily been done another way. And the romance subplot - WHYYYYYYYYYYY?

The action was fine but sparse and not as practical as in the first one. The CGI was largely awful. The main villain did almost nothing. The good ideas were barely explored (like Harry getting used to his lack of depth perception). Amazing that a movie that long had so little substance in it.
Speaking of movies requiring a post-mortem ... let me know if/when you see Fantastic Beasts 2. It has so many unnecessary subplots and irrelevant characters that it makes Kingsman 2 seem like a lesson in concise storytelling and leanness. I'm not a Harry Potter fan - my only experience is seeing all the movies once, and I thought Fantastic Beasts was okay-at-best-but-a-tinge-towards-negative. This was horrible.

It was complete devoid of any magic. And I don't mean that in a cheesy way, but from watching the previous movies, I get a sense of the world bigger than the world. And you can see this even with the stuff in Fantastic Beasts 1 that didn't work, like the Death Room. There's a culture to the Wizarding World. This had none of that. All the stuff about regional differences? Gone, even though most of it takes place in France. It's far more generic overblown blockbuster complete with non-ending than anything Harry Potter. I actually never appreciated how fleshed out the Potterverse felt until this movie.

I want to get into it more, but I don't want to go on a full rant if no one else has seen it but both Law and Depp are wasted, and none of the original cast members save Newt needed to return. And not to get SJW, but Tina who I remember being somewhat capable in the last movie, might as well be a robot. She becomes the shitty type of female character whose sole purpose is to stand by the male and say nothing. I could be wrong, but I don't think she contributes anything in this movie at all. Though I did like her in her leather trench coat, that with her hair kind of made her look like Dr. Mrs. The Monarch in her Council outfit.

Would I vouch for it? Great question. Probably not. It's over 2 hours and requires one to watch Fantastic Beasts 1, which isn't good enough to recommend nor bad enough to HitW. It's also quite boring and never gets bad enough in a Kingsman 2 way to be overly interesting for our purposes.

But if/when you see it, let me know. I think it could generate discussion.
 
Last edited:

Stormrider666

Hell is home.
Donator
Here is something to ponder. "Country Road" appeared in three 21st Century Fox productions last year. Channing Tatum and Katherine Waterson each appeared in two out of the three and co-starred in one of them. The song only made sense in Logan Lucky. So who was responsible for it being in Alien: Covenant and The Golden Circle. My money is on Tatum since him making LL would explain his brief appearance in TGC.

Or maybe 21st Century Fox owns the rights to the song since it once appeared in an episode of American Dad and like it using every chance they can get.
 

LiddyRules

RIP King of France. Gutted Like Fish Under R Line
Here is something to ponder. "Country Road" appeared in three 21st Century Fox productions last year. Channing Tatum and Katherine Waterson each appeared in two out of the three and co-starred in one of them. The song only made sense in Logan Lucky. So who was responsible for it being in Alien: Covenant and The Golden Circle. My money is on Tatum since him making LL would explain his brief appearance in TGC.

Or maybe 21st Century Fox owns the rights to the song since it once appeared in an episode of American Dad and like it using every chance they can get.
Logan Lucky is the only one of those movies that song even remotely connects to.

In one, it's a German woman hundreds of years in the future singing from space. It's not that popular a song now. And why she sang that instead of saying "SOS. This is the Prometheus. We are the last survivors." Fuck if I know. I assume the Prometheus is a pretty famous ship in that universe and finding it would be very important.

In the other, it's an English tech guy in the middle of the jungle. I'm not saying English people can't like that song. I'm not saying you can't play that song in the jungle. But for the emotional link they were so desperately trying for, it didn't fit at all.

So let me close by asking you and @Pigdango this - of the recent sequelboots, which is the best/worst? Alien: Covenant, The Predator, or Terminator: Genisys. Because I'd put The Predator as best and Terminator: Genisys as worst. But I really hate Covenant, so it's a toss-up.
 

Stormrider666

Hell is home.
Donator
Logan Lucky is the only one of those movies that song even remotely connects to.

In one, it's a German woman hundreds of years in the future singing from space. It's not that popular a song now. And why she sang that instead of saying "SOS. This is the Prometheus. We are the last survivors." Fuck if I know. I assume the Prometheus is a pretty famous ship in that universe and finding it would be very important.

In the other, it's an English tech guy in the middle of the jungle. I'm not saying English people can't like that song. I'm not saying you can't play that song in the jungle. But for the emotional link they were so desperately trying for, it didn't fit at all.

So let me close by asking you and @Pigdango this - of the recent sequelboots, which is the best/worst? Alien: Covenant, The Predator, or Terminator: Genisys. Because I'd put The Predator as best and Terminator: Genisys as worst. But I really hate Covenant, so it's a toss-up.
"Rule Britannia" or "God Save The Queen" would have been a better song for Merlin to sing during that scene.

I haven't seen The Predator yet. But from what I have heard, it sounds more like a disappointment rather than a bad movie. That's what I was thinking when I asked the "Which franchise needs to call it a day" question.

Genisys sounds bad. But I have to go with Covenant. Not only did I think it was a bad, but I was bored with the whole xenomorph thing while I was watching it.
 

Pigdango

Silence, you mortal Fuck!
Donator
"Rule Britannia" or "God Save The Queen" would have been a better song for Merlin to sing during that scene.

I haven't seen The Predator yet. But from what I have heard, it sounds more like a disappointment rather than a bad movie. That's what I was thinking when I asked the "Which franchise needs to call it a day" question.

Genisys sounds bad. But I have to go with Covenant. Not only did I think it was a bad, but I was bored with the whole xenomorph thing while I was watching it.
I think that they are all terrible for the same reason - all three movies seem to acknowledge that they really don’t think there’s anything else to do with these franchises, but the studios keep offering them money to try, so each one tries to “expand” the universe by retconning the original movies.

Termy Genny’s premise started out the strongest in a way - I mean it’s certainly faithful to the original concept to send a Terminator back to kill/protect little kid Sarah Conner. So that didn’t break things - making John Connor a bad guy corrupted by Skynet certainly did, and left the franchise with nowhere to go. For all it’s problems it was at least the most fun Termy movie since T2.

The Predator was also fun, but it broke the franchise in nearly every conceivable way, shattering the entire concept of the movie and leaving things with the promise of Iron Predator humans vs Enhanced Predators. Plus the movie is flat out offensive, and not in a good way - in that tone deaf way that only the worst movies pull off.

Covefe took a giant shit on the franchise as well, and l think gets my vote as the worst because it somehow - almost impossibly, manages to not just shit on the entire concept behind original movies, but on the Prequel that it was a sequel to. Plus it’s not a fun movie at all, it’s completely lazy and incompetent. The one fun moment of the movie (I’ll do the fingering) was intended to be super serious and insightful, but they wreck any chances of that ever being taken seriously with the abortion of a “fine, you want Aliens killing people on a ship? Fuck your here it is” third act.

Also, Covefe was the one I instantly hated. It took me a few minutes to decide The Predator was shit, and an entire car ride home for Termy.
 

Pigdango

Silence, you mortal Fuck!
Donator
"Rule Britannia" or "God Save The Queen" would have been a better song for Merlin to sing during that scene.

I haven't seen The Predator yet. But from what I have heard, it sounds more like a disappointment rather than a bad movie. That's what I was thinking when I asked the "Which franchise needs to call it a day" question.

Genisys sounds bad. But I have to go with Covenant. Not only did I think it was a bad, but I was bored with the whole xenomorph thing while I was watching it.
I think that they are all terrible for the same reason - all three movies seem to acknowledge that they really don’t think there’s anything else to do with these franchises, but the studios keep offering them money to try, so each one tries to “expand” the universe by retconning the original movies.

Termy Genny’s premise started out the strongest in a way - I mean it’s certainly faithful to the original concept to send a Terminator back to kill/protect little kid Sarah Conner. So that didn’t break things - making John Connor a bad guy corrupted by Skynet certainly did, and left the franchise with nowhere to go. For all it’s problems it was at least the most fun Termy movie since T2.

The Predator was also fun, but it broke the franchise in nearly every conceivable way, shattering the entire concept of the movie and leaving things with the promise of Iron Predator humans vs Enhanced Predators. Plus the movie is flat out offensive, and not in a good way - in that tone deaf way that only the worst movies pull off.

Covefe took a giant shit on the franchise as well, and l think gets my vote as the worst because it somehow - almost impossibly, manages to not just shit on the entire concept behind original movies, but on the Prequel that it was a sequel to. Plus it’s not a fun movie at all, it’s completely lazy and incompetent. The one fun moment of the movie (I’ll do the fingering) was intended to be super serious and insightful, but they wreck any chances of that ever being taken seriously with the abortion of a “fine, you want Aliens killing people on a ship? Fuck your here it is” third act.

Also, Covefe was the one I instantly hated. It took me a few minutes to decide The Predator was shit, and an entire car ride home for Termy.
Logan Lucky is the only one of those movies that song even remotely connects to.

In one, it's a German woman hundreds of years in the future singing from space. It's not that popular a song now. And why she sang that instead of saying "SOS. This is the Prometheus. We are the last survivors." Fuck if I know. I assume the Prometheus is a pretty famous ship in that universe and finding it would be very important.

In the other, it's an English tech guy in the middle of the jungle. I'm not saying English people can't like that song. I'm not saying you can't play that song in the jungle. But for the emotional link they were so desperately trying for, it didn't fit at all.

So let me close by asking you and @Pigdango this - of the recent sequelboots, which is the best/worst? Alien: Covenant, The Predator, or Terminator: Genisys. Because I'd put The Predator as best and Terminator: Genisys as worst. But I really hate Covenant, so it's a toss-up.
 

Pigdango

Silence, you mortal Fuck!
Donator
I don’t know what’s going on with wackbag/my phone, but I’m too tired to try to fix it.
 

LiddyRules

RIP King of France. Gutted Like Fish Under R Line
I think that they are all terrible for the same reason - all three movies seem to acknowledge that they really don’t think there’s anything else to do with these franchises, but the studios keep offering them money to try, so each one tries to “expand” the universe by retconning the original movies.

Termy Genny’s premise started out the strongest in a way - I mean it’s certainly faithful to the original concept to send a Terminator back to kill/protect little kid Sarah Conner. So that didn’t break things - making John Connor a bad guy corrupted by Skynet certainly did, and left the franchise with nowhere to go. For all it’s problems it was at least the most fun Termy movie since T2.

The Predator was also fun, but it broke the franchise in nearly every conceivable way, shattering the entire concept of the movie and leaving things with the promise of Iron Predator humans vs Enhanced Predators. Plus the movie is flat out offensive, and not in a good way - in that tone deaf way that only the worst movies pull off.

Covefe took a giant shit on the franchise as well, and l think gets my vote as the worst because it somehow - almost impossibly, manages to not just shit on the entire concept behind original movies, but on the Prequel that it was a sequel to. Plus it’s not a fun movie at all, it’s completely lazy and incompetent. The one fun moment of the movie (I’ll do the fingering) was intended to be super serious and insightful, but they wreck any chances of that ever being taken seriously with the abortion of a “fine, you want Aliens killing people on a ship? Fuck your here it is” third act.

Also, Covefe was the one I instantly hated. It took me a few minutes to decide The Predator was shit, and an entire car ride home for Termy.
That's fair, even if I have some disagreements. I hated Terminator Genisys pretty much immediately - from their ability to travel through time at will, the use of the Cops theme, the pointless callbacks, Matt Smith as Skynet, Jai Courtney's horrendous performance - and don't actually hate The Predator. But my hatred for Covenant is deeper and more complex.
 

Pigdango

Silence, you mortal Fuck!
Donator
That's fair, even if I have some disagreements. I hated Terminator Genisys pretty much immediately - from their ability to travel through time at will, the use of the Cops theme, the pointless callbacks, Matt Smith as Skynet, Jai Courtney's horrendous performance - and don't actually hate The Predator. But my hatred for Covenant is deeper and more complex.
To put my long winded, typo riddled answer more succinctly - As bad as they are, Predator and Genisys don’t show the contempt for the franchise that Covenant does. I think for me that’s always the unforgivable sin of a movie like this. Hence why I hate the Snyder DC movies so much.
 

LiddyRules

RIP King of France. Gutted Like Fish Under R Line
To put my long winded, typo riddled answer more succinctly - As bad as they are, Predator and Genisys don’t show the contempt for the franchise that Covenant does. I think for me that’s always the unforgivable sin of a movie like this. Hence why I hate the Snyder DC movies so much.
Did you read about the aborted Prometheus 3?

https://www.indiewire.com/2018/11/a...s-ridley-scott-michael-fassbender-1202020723/

And you just don't get the Snyder-verse. We needed 10 movies before Superman and Batman stopped randomly brutally murdering people. That's the story that needed to be told!
 

Discoman

Well-Known Member
Donator
I just watched this the other day with a friend that had seen the first Kingsman so he was able to fill in the gaps for me.

I read an apt summary for this film which was, "This feels like an adult spykids movie". The villain, Polly seems to be weird for weirdness sake: 50's diners in the middle of Incan ruins that is explained for second but in no way pushes the plot forward and inflicting zany dancing sickness on her victims. That along with the unnecessary Elton John cameo which was longer than Channing Tatum's, who has billing over both Elton and Pedro Pascal.

The movie doesn't know what it's drug message is, it is pro-drug reform or anti-drug reform? Polly wants to end the drug war, but that's bad because corporations become the new dealers. While the president wants all the addicts dead, thus finally ending the drug war, but that's bad because people 'experiment', and the Secretary of State never heard of 5 hour energy. Both sides lose and we end up with a Drug addict for a president. Yay? What happened to the vice president? What did the President do that was illegal, exactly? Also that stadium full of caged addicts is up there with the demon factory from "I, Frankenstein" as being the most ridiculous short order assembly line I've seen in a film.

Then there's the little things, like the Statesmen brewing Whiskey instead of Bourbon, which would be more fitting with Merlin's bitching as both Scotch and Bourbon are derived from Whiskey (With an E you limey prick). Why did I have to see that lady's CGI vagina? Why didn't the mine sweeper detect the mine? Why didn't the mine blow up instantly like they actually do? Why did the goons just all get as close to Merlin as possible? The list goes on and on.

Having said all that. Was the first one good?
 

LiddyRules

RIP King of France. Gutted Like Fish Under R Line
I just watched this the other day with a friend that had seen the first Kingsman so he was able to fill in the gaps for me.

I read an apt summary for this film which was, "This feels like an adult spykids movie". The villain, Polly seems to be weird for weirdness sake: 50's diners in the middle of Incan ruins that is explained for second but in no way pushes the plot forward and inflicting zany dancing sickness on her victims. That along with the unnecessary Elton John cameo which was longer than Channing Tatum's, who has billing over both Elton and Pedro Pascal.

The movie doesn't know what it's drug message is, it is pro-drug reform or anti-drug reform? Polly wants to end the drug war, but that's bad because corporations become the new dealers. While the president wants all the addicts dead, thus finally ending the drug war, but that's bad because people 'experiment', and the Secretary of State never heard of 5 hour energy. Both sides lose and we end up with a Drug addict for a president. Yay? What happened to the vice president? What did the President do that was illegal, exactly? Also that stadium full of caged addicts is up there with the demon factory from "I, Frankenstein" as being the most ridiculous short order assembly line I've seen in a film.

Then there's the little things, like the Statesmen brewing Whiskey instead of Bourbon, which would be more fitting with Merlin's bitching as both Scotch and Bourbon are derived from Whiskey (With an E you limey prick). Why did I have to see that lady's CGI vagina? Why didn't the mine sweeper detect the mine? Why didn't the mine blow up instantly like they actually do? Why did the goons just all get as close to Merlin as possible? The list goes on and on.

Having said all that. Was the first one good?
I remember liking the first one. But K2 does the worst thing a sequel can do - make you question whether the first one was even good.
 
Top